My crappy Petra concert experience!

brent · Post by **brent** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 2:19 pm

Wait now folks. What sin did Wayne commit? How is this indicative of the church being in a downward spiral?

Comments about the size of a guys light rig may not have been sensitive to his "feelings", but that is not a sin. The truth sometimes hurts. If you are going to succeed in the world of production, you have to just accept that kind of stuff.

These guys just flew or drove in to town, and found a lighting rig that sounds like a small club system or something. If Wayne did his job, he probably made a couple of follow-ups with the promoter before arriving and was told that everything was good to go. I would be a bit bent myself. True, I wouldn't be a jack about it, but I would not need the inconvenience. I have been there by the way.

I don't get it.

clyde · Post by **clyde** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 2:25 pm

Ya know...I wrote a recently wrote a "ranting" of mine on this particular subject.....Christian Love.....where did it go? Yes, there are times that we all have to make difficult decisions but we dont have to forget about love. You know that Sue was right on when she said to NOT cease doing good, I hope that maybe we all can remember a lesson from this and remeber to show others the same Love that Jesus showed us...even when we are being disciplened we are shown compassion and grace....how much more should we show the same. How can we expect the lost to see the love of Jesus if we treat our own with such little compassion.
Be encouraged brother, what you were doing was not for the church, Petra or Wayne, but for His Glory, do all things in that matter and in the end you shall endure.....but at the same time remeber the only perfect man on this earth was crucified! Serve Him bro....let Jesus be glorified!

Shell · Post by **Shell** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 2:44 pm

We can sin with our attitude and how we treat people, and that goes for anyone. The Bible has a lot to say about attitude.

Truth is fine, but truth administered without a bit of compassion along with it is nothing but brutality. The truth shouldn't be used to deliberately hurt or beat someone up.

executioner · Post by **executioner** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 3:02 pm

Perfectly said Shell.

PJ · Post by PJ » Mon Oct 10, 2005 3:21 pm

A couple of things,

Tim, You are a good man and a true servant, I am sorry things went down the way they did with the lights, not my call.

Secondly, guys lets please remember Matt 18, if you are offended by a brother go to him in private to win your brother over so that you will both come to a place of repentance, forgiveness and restoration, please don't use this board as a place for cheap shots and being disgruntled, their was some major miscommunication concerning the light situation, I thought Tim had more than enough good lights, from the list of bands he worked with and the list of lights he gave me, management thought otherwise and it is there call, they are the one is in charge

Tim please email me or call me, I tried to call you a few minutes ago.

People were blessed, memories were made, sorry you were hurt Tim, if we had any role in that, i ask your forgiveness publically.

Jeff

clyde · Post by **clyde** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 3:24 pm

Great point Jeff.....thanks!

interactiveguy · Post by **interactiveguy** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 3:36 pm

I didn't even get an "all access pass" The stupid kids from the churches youth group that were helping out even got one.

Does this comment bother anyone else? How can you complain about people being rude and then say "The stupid kids for the churches youth group"?

Why are the kids stupid?

Could that be a plank in your eye????

kngser88 · Post by **kngser88** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 3:40 pm

I guess for me it is amazing that this squabble about lights led to this...I understand if it was sound....but lights? Come on....Petra on there farewell tour, complaining about how many lights they have....I go to a concert for a great live sound.....lights are very backgfround for me...And I could be wrong but he couldn't have had any less lights them the WV concert..But...what do I know?

also, I apologize for my remarks...But it really irks me when The church ( yes I include petra managers) tear down a persons effort to help and don't think twice about it.....And it ain't just happening once...But think about it this way....he had to answer to God for it.

brent · Post by **brent** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 4:11 pm

Guys, we don't even know the whole story about what Wayne said, how it was said, etc. You guys happen to know that Wayne is course sometimes, and now you guys are all ASSUMING that Wayne must be a jack because he is Wayne. Ok, so if Wayne is scum, then what does this matter anyway? It sounds like this lighting guy is a bit immature.

I remember the first time that I say Petra load in at a show. It was the NSD/MPTY era. As the gear came in, so did the beer for the roadies. The next tour Petra was using Rez bands PA and crew, who also drank like crazy. You can't ASSUME that all involved will be as dedicated to God and His work as the artist. For that matter, you have no guarantees that any of the guys in Petra are walking the walk 100% of the time either. Infact, I think there is proof that some have not. Christian record companies are not all Christian. Some churches are not all Christian. Your pastor may be here after the rapture. Who knows?

Attitude:

If I was Wayne, I would ASSUME that the sound and light company was there for commerce' sake (to make money on services provided) and there to do as little as possible to get paid. That is common. How is he supposed to read this guy's mind and know that he is so tender? Jesus was the only one to be able to do that.

Ok, so we should have Christian love, etc. That doesn't mean that we all walk around with warm fuzzies all of the time. Come on. Let's make this a ministry thing, instead of a lighting provider issue. Paul didn't get along with a ministry partner and sent for another. If Paul can do it, why can't Wayne?

I know for a FACT, because the words came from John Schlitts two lips, that he is VERY concerned about Petra's production quality. I know for a fact that his logic is that it should look the best, sound the best and be the best for the budget. If you skimp, people notice and then spread the word. So, if you want to get mad at anyone, go to Wayne's boss and talk to him about this trivial snipe.

BForm · Post by **BForm** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 4:38 pm

Alright, I have a true story to tell, but it doesn't include personal gossip about Wayne. A few years ago I was investigating putting on a FREE Petra concert in a high traffic mall. In fact, it's the largest Mall in the South, called the Mall of Georgia. I had the money and the means.

However, after hearing all of the disappointment with Wayne, promoters no longer bringing Petra because of him, etc., I started having serious doubts. I began to doubt PETRA because the buck stops with them. In the end, I could not justify spending 6,000 for a one night concert when I could build a church in Kenya and pay the Pastor for two years with the same amount of money.

It's just sad that I had uncertain feelings about Petra because of their manager, but it's the truth. I'm sure I'm not the only one that has had those feelings, and that's very unfortunate. Sometimes those we are yoked to will drag us down with them.

Having said all of that, I have to question the motive for bringing up this complaint in a public forum. Is there some good you expect to come from this? Or is this just an opportunity for a little revenge by publicly chastizing a brother outside his presence?

sue d. · Post by **sue d.** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 4:48 pm

I believe Sue's "Wayne is Wayne" comment wasn't to justify his behaviour, just an added point to say we can't let other people drag us down.

Right. I'm just saying that this is how he can be on the road (and in the office), and not to take it personally.

Ok, so we should have Christian love, etc. That doesn't mean that we all walk around with warm fuzzies all of the time.

If we are a Christian, that means we should do our best to represent Christ in every way and in every part of our life. Paul says:

"Imitate me, just as I also imitate Christ." 1 Corinthians 11:1

Period. No exceptions for stressful circumstances, hard times nor difficult situations.

Christ would have gently but firmly asked to have the lighting rig taken down... and probably would have offered an explanation without the sarcasm.

But none of us are Christ, and we're far from His perfection. We can only try. Some try harder than others.

Alan · Post by **Alan** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 5:25 pm

[quote="interactiveguy"]I didn't even get an "all access pass" The stupid kids from the churches youth group that were helping out even got one.

Does this comment bother anyone else? How can you complain about people being rude and then say "The stupid kids for the churches youth group"?

wow!
yeah, it hit me. i remember after shows the pay was seeing the hearts and minds of the kids moved & changed as we visited with them afterwards about jesus. i sure havent done this for the money.
thank God that there are stupid kids in the church's youth groups helping.

i will be working at the enid Petra concert at a booth, however i didnt get an all day pass for free either. my partner and i opted to take proceeds from sales and help sponser the event.

to me its all about the edifying of the people, and praising God with the music. not Wayne, or how someone got offended by him, not the lights, or the sound. john can sing accapella in the dark for all i care,
and the house would still shake.

alan

beak · Post by **beak** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:03 pm

I have and still have a light show nothing even close tothe author of this thread. I would be upset and I would have no problem talking about it here, that is what we are here for, to discuss life with and this does include Petra. I would'nt get to upset, Petra isn't going to be around only for a few more months. Maybe if this Wayne wasn't around maybe Petra would have had more gigs in the past, but so long Wayne in Jan. 2006. I have been offended by people even Petheads from here (in real life). They seem to get offended when you're honest and say your own feelings. Not all but a few that I've met. Keep your head up man any light show would have been better than what I saw 10/02/05 because the stage was was EMPTY! I was not impressed with NOTHING! Even my small 30 can light show and fog would have been better than NOTHING!

brent · Post by **brent** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:49 pm

beak wrote: but so long Wayne in Jan. 2006.

I wouldn't be to sure about that. Last I heard Wayne would still be part of John's team. That's what I heard a month ago.

Sue, you are closer to the source...what do you think?

misterbob · Post by **misterbob** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 9:14 pm

...just stop beating this dead horse folks?

Does it really matter in the end? The thread's author went the extra mile to do his very best for God and Petra. Wayne is doing his very best for God and Petra. For this matter, Petra is doing their very best for God and Petra.

Isn't that enough? In my small view, neither the thread's author nor Wayne are that far off base. Both wanted the same thing...they just went about it differently.

Let's move on!

The Petra Zone

My crappy Petra concert experience!

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