Corrupt Christian Music site developer responds!

[misterbob]

Hi folks...
I just received a very nice reply from the folks at Corrupt Christian Music. I would like to reply in an intelligent fashion. Please keep in mind that I know that this is probably a lost cause. However, I feel like I'm supposed to have this chat for some reason so I say "why not?"

Please review their comments and present me with some suggestions for my response. They had a lot of things in bold but I left that out because it made no difference.

Thanks so much y'all!

Dear Bob,
Thank you for taking the time to write us. We would be more than glad to discuss Petra and share with you the facts and information we have about them and please feel free to share our discussions with whomever you desire. Sorry for the delayed response we have many to respond to, and we do appreciate the manner in which you've asked your questions.
PETRA:
To begin with they are sadly no different than any of the other artists on our site. They have been another band to have pioneered many of todays 'Christian' musicians and artists compromise, paving the way for Christian Rock music to become accepted into Christianity.

� Did you know that at their beginning, their band was regarded and promoted as the "musical bad boys of Christian music". Should any true Christian have such a title?

� Not too long ago in the early 80's, Petra wasn't even accepted within the Christian circle, and were more ridiculed because of their 'hard' music. When Petra first was formed Christian's were calling Rock demonic music. You may disregard this saying they were just rigid, old fashioned ways of thinking, but the fruit of this Rock music becoming acceptible among Christians has been one tool to producing the following:

Todays Christians blending into the world, looking, talking and acting just like it

Todays Christians no longer know the definition of worldliness or sin

Todays Christians unashamedly listen to worldly musicians, following the example of their Christian musicians

Christian concerts hardly look any different than Woodstock and are full of sacriligious, irreverent behavior before our Heavenly Father

Petra's music has been referred to by many of the past as "being too secular". From their beginning they have copied, duplicated, and imitated secular/worldly bands such as Bon Jovi, Aerosmith, and Def Leppard.

� In 1982 Petra mellowed their rock tone, and went with a more pop sound because of the outrage and rejection of 'Christian' rock

� They were referred to as "Christian music's oldest and most successful rock band" showing that they have been a key group to lead many - but it's obvious they haven't led anyone into godliness, but worldliness.

Regardless if Petra says the right things or that they might mention God in their lyrics, they are not acceptable before God. Talking about God but living like the world is hypocrisy and is what they have bred in their followers. The Scriptures clearly teach that we are live a lifestyle that reflects Him, and a reflection is a duplication of Him, not a secular, ungodly, worldly band such as Aerosmith, or Def Leppard.

Is it okay to admire worldly, ungodly people? Did Herod influence Jesus or His disciples, John the Baptist or his?

The Scriptures also teach us that we are to know others by their fruit. This means that we can look at what they have produced and see if it has drawn people closer to God and His holy ways, or if instead its brought a mixture and worldliness. This is unacceptable before God and we as His people must be able to discern and test to know whether something is of Him or not, otherwise we will be deceived. A good tree produces good fruit and a bad tree produces bad fruit. We are living in a dangerous day where we must be so very careful, otherwise we will very easily become deceived along with the masses. It takes honesty and humility, not holding to our own thinking, but willing to accept the truth.
If we have truth we ought to strive to sway people to it, otherwise we don't believe in truth - but opinions. We would hope that through this dialogue you would reconsider your views and conform them to truth, for this is the way of salvation. As Jesus said it's the "truth that sets you free" and this is why we take so much time to document our points, to establish truth and expose the error.

Looking forward to hearing from you,
His Servants,
Corrup Christian Music

[Shell]

Well, it is good that they took the time to answer you, but I wonder where they're coming up with their criteria. They're taking stuff they've picked up from articles and using it out of context, I seriously doubt they've spent any time talking to the guys or bothered to listen to the music. What, are they supposed to be super human or something?

I say go for it if you want to reply to them, but I wouldn't hold my breath expecting them to change their thinking.

[epdc]

that shell says.

All that leaves me thinking, what would we consider secular?

what`s "secular" actually?

Secular is something of the world, not related to God, that`s what I see. And that has to do with the philosophy of the band or their lyrics, but not with the music.

This people says that Petra imitates aerosmith or bon jovi blablabla. I would agree if they were talking about that Petra is following the same ideas these bands have, but the only thing they are doing is maybe imitating the music style.

Music was created by God. Instruments were created by God. How come you say "this music is secular", the correct would be "this band is secular because in their lyrics they don`t sing to God but to "wordly" things and these people`s lives reflects an ungoldly life.

The music is music. Is something God did and the human being has decided for WHAT is gonna use it.- for God or for the world.

Petra didn`t make that christian music would mix with secular, AHA, that depends of each one. In fact, I truly believe the modern christian bands that are now have helped to reach people to Jesus, of course, I truly believe that not all christian concerts are that way. But we can`t judge ALL christian music by just seeing a couple of bands.

God is a party God. God loves to laugh, God loves to have fun. In fact, there`s a jewish party in the Bible (is a traditional party, it appears in mmm deuteronomy) that last like a week, night and day. God likes to have fun. God created music for us to use it for praising Him. We just can`t act religious and say "we won`t use this music style for preaching the Gospel because in the world people listen this music style". WHY????, I mean, WHY?????, God created music and the enemy has took it for attacking people, why we won`t use this weapon for God`s glory?.


this people say that Petra has led people more to the world than to God. I have to disagree with that. I , and I know many others, have been spoken by God through Petra. You just need to read their lyrics, read more about their lives. Many some of them have committ BIG mistakes but ya know what?, what we gotta see is not the mistake, but what they DID after that. Did they rose up again?, did they become stronger in their faith?.

when this people say their concerts look more like a secular concert, like woodtock, what do they mean?, do they mean that kids have fun like jumping, dancing, singing?, God likes that, God gave us voices for singing and a body for dancing, He created the dance.because if they are talking about sex, drugs and beer I don`t think you would see that on a Petra concert or with a christian band on stage. I think that not only the band would have something to with it but also the pastors and the people that is organizing the event. The band is hired to perform and to preach the Gospel, but it depends of the people that is organizing that no drugs be there for example.


I know that many bands call themselves christian and they don`t act like one, but not all (Petra) are that way. I don`t think christian music is "mixing itself" with secular music, because music was made by God and we have the right to use it too. I believe there`s a mix if we talk about their personal ideas, the lyrics, what they are singing about. But music is just music. Secular music is musi that talks about other things but God and christian music is the one that is used for His glory.

Only because ska (wich is modern and was used first by secular people) is modern and everyone in the world likes it, doesn`t mean christians can`t use it because "is secular", who said it was secular?, the musician`s philosophy might be secular but not the music, we can use the music.

that`s all I have to say.

[BigD]

I feel like venting, so I'm going to rip apart this clown. It'll feel good even if he never sees it.

Did you know that at their beginning, their band was regarded and promoted as the "musical bad boys of Christian music". Should any true Christian have such a title?

My title for you is a "complete and utter idiot". Does that make you one?

Seriously, give me some backing informatin or don't make that kind of claim.

Not too long ago in the early 80's, Petra wasn't even accepted within the Christian circle, and were more ridiculed because of their 'hard' music. When Petra first was formed Christian's were calling Rock demonic music.

Petra's music has been referred to by many of the past as "being too secular".

Acceptance means nothing to God. He demands obedience. Ridicule means nothing, neither does being called "demonic". If I call you "demonic", does that make you so? No, it doesn't. And it's the same for Petra.

Todays Christians blending into the world, looking, talking and acting just like it

Todays Christians no longer know the definition of worldliness or sin

Todays Christians unashamedly listen to worldly musicians, following the example of their Christian musicians

Statements mean nothing without any proof behind them.

From their beginning they have copied, duplicated, and imitated secular/worldly bands such as Bon Jovi, Aerosmith, and Def Leppard.

I love this argument, because so many anti-christian music people use it. I hate to break it to you, but God look at the HEART AND CONTENT OF THE LYRICS-not how it's played. You don't have to like the style, but God accepts it if the person behind it is saying and doing the right things.

They were referred to as "Christian music's oldest and most successful rock band" showing that they have been a key group to lead many - but it's obvious they haven't led anyone into godliness, but worldliness.

You're completely right here. Oh wait, you're still wrong.

Maybe they were referred to as that because they ARE CHRISTIAN MUSIC'S OLDEST AND MOST SUCCESSFULL ROCK BAND. Even if they aren't/weren't, this is the same argument as before-being called something DOES NOT MEAN YOU ARE SOMETHING.

Regardless if Petra says the right things or that they might mention God in their lyrics, they are not acceptable before God. Talking about God but living like the world is hypocrisy and is what they have bred in their followers. The Scriptures clearly teach that we are live a lifestyle that reflects Him, and a reflection is a duplication of Him, not a secular, ungodly, worldly band such as Aerosmith, or Def Leppard.

That's for God to judge, not you. Or at least provide solid backing evidence and not completely vague statements as you've done so far. What about Petra's lifestyle makes them like the world?

James 4:12 says "There is only one Lawgiver and Judge, the one who is able to save and destroy. But you-who are you to jduge your neighbour?"

It takes honesty and humility, not holding to our own thinking, but willing to accept the truth.

Funny, I was just about to say the same thing to you.

Yeah, he'll never see it, but this felt very good to write. Cheers.

[misterbob]

Hi BigD...why do think that they won't see your reply? I plan to use all of our thoughts to create a well thought out reply.

[BigD]

I just wasn't going to go out of my way to e-mail this guy-you can use whatever you want from my posts.

I've checked out the site, and honestly I don't see how they have a leg to stand on. So much of what they use to condemn christian artists is vague and inconclusive.

[Shell]

Hehehe.

I can understand why you're annoyed Dennis, but ignorant people can't be reasoned with, which I guess is why you're not going to bother to
e-mail them.

It's one thing to bring up honest concerns, but to make accusations just to be hurtful, and without anything really concrete to back it up is wrong. Someone (I think it was Michael) said he thought they just hated rock music and were trying to get around that with their accusations, and he's probably right.

They should ask themselves if they're really saying all this stuff out of concern in hopes of maybe improving CCM, or if they're just being judgmental, which happens to be unbiblical too by the way.

[epdc]

I don`t think Christian music is mixng with secular music (if you say that you are assuming that rock music, pop music or ska music are exclusive for the world when actually God did it all),

what I think is that christian bands are taking what is our by inheritance as God`s children.- christian bands are just taking what the world has taken (music) and using is for God`s glory.

[monster machine]

Seriously, it has to be that someone over there doesn�t like rock music. I mean, come on � music itself is evil? Please. I have read a lot of people who don�t like the beat in rock music. But even their old hymns follow a beat, it�s only accentuated in rock music. And perhaps it should be pointed out that even their beloved author of so many favourite hymns, Fanny J. Crosby, used to write bar songs, but changed all of the lyrics when she became a Christian and left the music the same, note for note.

Don�t these people understand that God�s revelation to an individual comes in His own time? I mean, does God (or these bashers) expect a non-believer to literally change overnight? It seems obvious God doesn�t but these people do. Would it not be appropriate then for God to use a band like Petra to even just plant the seed that might lead to a full blown resurrection in Christ?

Why are they trying to limit what God can do? Why do these people always think that God can only save people through certain types of ministry and in certain ways? I know we are not supposed to be of the world, but heaven help us, we do have to live in it.

Perhaps, MisterBob, you should ask them if they ever considered speaking to the band members themselves to get a more rounded opinion of what Petra is trying to accomplish? Perhaps this site should consider this � how else would you go about effectively ministering to a teenager who is already in the world?

[BigD]

They can't be reasoned with Shell, but it sure is fun to rip them to pieces and watch them try to defend themselves. Hence why I'm not going to e-mail them but be happy to faciliate someone else's e-mail (such as our good man misterbob).

Besides, I've already pissed off Dial-the-truth ministries (another christian rock bashing site) and I think doing that to two of them might be bad karma.

[Shell]

They probably wouldn't be ticked at you if they didn't know they were wrong. People who are wrong and know it don't like to be told. I know who Dial-the-truth is, and they're full of, you know, Schlitt. I say more power to you.

[Buddy Pearl]

Well I don't even know where to start. I love Petra and know they changed my life as well as countless others. People like this are sure to always be around, in fact being atacted can be a sign that your on the right track. It's easy to condem and judge and I feel sorry for them, cause every word will be accounted for.

Show me one person who because of Petra went worldly, or tried drugs, turned away from God, or any other thing that whould come from such a worldy band such as decsribed. I don't think there ever would be, or has been a such a case. People have free wills and very different views and interpetations so you could arrgue but even if, look at all the testiomonys. I know they have brought me closer to God, not the world, God. It was God's power and anointing through them that did it, but they were the vessel. Would they be used by God in such a way if they were truly "Not acceptable before God"? This is something arguable in masses but try to tell me that I'm decived? I don't think so.

Yes, lets look at fruit! I see lots of good fruit! Love , joy, peace, longsuffering, goodness, gentleness, meekness temperance, faith, I see souls, not just saved but growing, nurtured, beautiful souls that are not afraid to stand up against the flow. Souls who love God and know the word of God and stand upon it. Souls who don't listen to people like them and know what God has done in thier lives.

I thank God every day for Petra (Ok I may miss a few).
No other band has made such an impact on my life.

Petra didn't start, teach, and mentor these "wanna be Christian bands that set bad examples". That's not thier fruit.
Who says Petra's "living like the world"? How would they know. They just wanted to say what they wanted without proof and easily. I'm sure they feel good and think they are right; But if they think they can tell us Petheads that easily, well thay have a lot coming!

Do you think if we all told our testimony concerning Petra they might just think a little. I mean they don't seem to know much about them, and mabey God can work in thier hearts.

Wow, that was a lot. I just love Petra to much to just hear that, what can I say.

[ErioL]

So what IS a good Christian band? Apparently Petra is fake, even though every song, through the ups and downs, has been about God and glorifies God. I dont know man...They're like ultra-liberals, they don't accept sense.

[Shell]

Hi Tori, long time no hear from young lady. Yeah, it's just ignorance, somebody doesn't like rock. They slam all these bands and don't really make it clear what they would consider a good Christian band. And they are taking it upon themselves to decide what God can and can't use.

[epdc]

nice to see you

If a band, any band, took petra example and did something worldy in their music, that�s their problem. if someone took petra style and started to play secular, that�s their problem, but their message is clear.