But I'm seeing people who just have to be right no matter what (and I'm not directing that at anyone specifically). A wise person will realize they aren't always right and that someone else may have a different opinion.Please, be civilized.You know something, it was a comment like this in the first thread that started the bickering in the first place, and it came from the same person. You, sir, are fixated on the idea that being pro-American and supporting our president is somehow tantamount to idolatry.
Basically, you're discriminating against those of us who believe in the values of the USA and who support our president by calling us pagans in the above quote. You have several times accused those of us who love our country of equating Bush with God and America as the Chosen One or the Promised Land as well as other radical statements. You might as well call us heathens next time!
You know what? I'M TIRED OF THIS! I don't have the "freedom" to post my opinions without being accused to be things I'm not. I thought I was discussing with people of Christian lifestyle, but I'm wrong. Feel free to put the flag and your ideology upon the cross. I don't hate americans, mexicans, canadians, chinese, even martians, because I don't have reasons to hate people. I'm a born again Christian, who tries to live for the Gospel and to love the Lord above all things. But I though my opinion (and, for extension, my person) would be respected, even if people do not agree with. And, for sure, no one is obligated to agree with me, but I though Christian love would be a standard for this discussion. But it's not. I'm out of this discussion!So don't start accusing anyone else of flying their flag above the cross. Instead, you need to get rid of the anti-American chip on your shoulder.
You first.Please, be civilized.
Most people take offense when something or someone they have much respect for is riducled by another person, especially when that person is making totally fallacious and uninformed accusations, so it's understandable that many of us are angry. You don't want discussion like this and you don't want people to be angry with you, then don't insult their government and their patriotism.Dear LexingtonPethead, be cool, I will not call all of you as heathen. But, you must agree with me, your behavior shows a lot of angry!
You DO have the freedom to post whatever you want, but it is also our "freedom" to defend against any accussations you make. If you don't want someone getting upset with you, don't say things that upset them.You know what? I'M TIRED OF THIS! I don't have the "freedom" to post my opinions without being accused to be things I'm not. I thought I was discussing with people of Christian lifestyle, but I'm wrong. Feel free to put the flag and your ideology upon the cross. I don't hate americans, mexicans, canadians, chinese, even martians, because I don't have reasons to hate people. I'm a born again Christian, who tries to live for the Gospel and to love the Lord above all things. But I though my opinion (and, for extension, my person) would be respected, even if people do not agree with. And, for sure, no one is obligated to agree with me, but I though Christian love would be a standard for this discussion. But it's not. I'm out of this discussion!
Dear separateunion, I said that I was out of this discussion. Please, if you want to talk about a lot of things, even about political issues, that's ok, but not offend me (as I didn't offend you) or try to be confrontative (as I did not). If you disagree with my opinions, that's ok. I do not agree with yours, and, for me, we can be brothers, even with some different ideas about politics. I did not offend no one because this is the second time I name someone. I did not put my finger upon no one. I'm not the owner of truth. But the truth isn't special property of no one. Truth is Christ. I think we, even disagreeing about some issues, can talk as mature people.Quote:
Please, be civilized.
You first.
What attitude must I change? The only attitude we all showed here is about our political tendencies. I thought, and still think, we can be mature on this issue. I did not offered insulting comments. I only showed my political opinion. You can agree with it or not, and that's ok to me. That's not a question of faith. But you must agree with me, attacking me (instead of disagreeing civilizatedly) only because I do not agree with the political opinions of some people, show a lack of love.It's funny how you expect Christian love when all you've offered have been abrasive, insulting comments. You may want to change your attitude before accussing us of not showing Christian love.
See, this is where you are ignorant and closed minded. When I say "totally fallacious and uninformed accussations" I am referring to the fact that rlima calls just about anyone who supports anything Bush does an idolater. THAT is insulting. Also, there is no proof that "Bush lied" as many would have you believe. To say that he did is to be uninformed.here's the trouble,
Differing views that are against the US anything, are called,"totally fallacious and uninformed accusations"
That cuts both ways. American propaganda would have every American believe that they are right and the rest of the world is ignorant and liberal or socialist. In the previous thread that was shut down I was trying to bring reason into the discussion rather than the victim mentality that NT Wright described.
The above quote is insulting and serves as further support for why this discussion should end quickly.
How did you NOT insult us? You came in throwing insults at our government, our president, and our patriotism. Excuse me that I and several others are upset about that. You don't have to point out a specific person to offend them If I were to say that all Brazilians were scum sucking morons, I'm sure you would be offended even though I did not draw you out specifically.Dear separateunion, I said that I was out of this discussion. Please, if you want to talk about a lot of things, even about political issues, that's ok, but not offend me (as I didn't offend you) or try to be confrontative (as I did not). If you disagree with my opinions, that's ok. I do not agree with yours, and, for me, we can be brothers, even with some different ideas about politics. I did not offend no one because this is the second time I name someone. I did not put my finger upon no one. I'm not the owner of truth. But the truth isn't special property of no one. Truth is Christ. I think we, even disagreeing about some issues, can talk as mature people.
Talking about our political view points is a discussion, but it is the attitude that you discuss your views that bothers many on this forum. I don't know why you are saying this hasn't been a mature discussion, because it really has stayed pretty civil and there hasn't been much mud slinging, if any at all. Also, no one has attacked you, as you have duped yourself into believing, so if you can't play with the big dogs without taking the heat, stay on the porch.What attitude must I change? The only attitude we all showed here is about our political tendencies. I thought, and still think, we can be mature on this issue. I did not offered insulting comments. I only showed my political opinion. You can agree with it or not, and that's ok to me. That's not a question of faith. But you must agree with me, attacking me (instead of disagreeing civilizatedly) only because I do not agree with the political opinions of some people, show a lack of love.
This is what I was trying to talk about!I know that Americans love their country and I commend you for it. But American patriotism does have a problem. To the outside world there is a risk of becoming arrogance. I'm not accusing anyone here. You are truly wonderful for standing up for what you believe in. But you can at least try to imagine how it is to look at things from the outside. Apparently none of you is able to do so.
The cross must be higher than the flag. And because Americans raise their flag pretty high, sometimes it looks like there's nothing above the flag. I do know that the cross is higher than the flag for each one of you. I want to urge you to act like that.
When you feel like you're insulted, restrain yourself. Don't get angry for nothing. Because no one is trying to insult you. You immediately see anti-American sentiments in everyone who says something against the flag. Don't.
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