Are there any "good" Christian Rock Bands anymore?

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Are there any "good" Christian Rock Bands anymore?

Post by zak89 » Wed Jun 05, 2013 5:27 pm

So, for all my insistence of being a 80s child who won't listen to almost any record more recent than '95, I found myself listening to a WOW 2013 playlist yesterday, and in between eye rolls and winces (why does every CCM male vocalist have to sound like he's got mild emphysema?), I heard (to my recollection) my first Skillet track.

Frankly, I was a bit stunned by how much I liked it. Really liked it. It's modern power rock through and through, with all the slickness of modern production and over compression, but the end result caught my ear and the lyrics were ringing in my head for hours.

But alas, a bit of research confirmed my stereotypical expectations - generic, "positive" lyrics and a stage presence that did little to present the band's (genuine, I have little doubt) faith, let alone the Gospel. In the end, I felt a bit ripped off, caught up in a musical "high" only to find there was no there, there. Turned out I wasn't the only one: http://thepetrazone.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=56138

This has been my experience with multiple artists in today's "Christian" rock genre, which I won't list here. Frankly, I don't really want to rehash my disappointment anyway, nor do I want to offend any Skillet fans out there (I really really *want* to like them, so feel free to correct me). Nor am I trying to put down anyone who enjoys these "positive" bands - I'm cool with that, it's just not what I'm looking for.

What I'm wondering is if there are any solid Christian, modern rock/metal artists out there today? And by solid, I'm primarily referring to a strong, unashamed Christian message - either lyrically or even in their stage presence (some songs that might sound a little ambiguous alone can be redeemed by a bold live presentation, IMO). Preferably something with a musical kick, too. 8)

There's a handful that I feel good about, namely:
Disciple (Hard rock - very strong lyrics, strong spiritual focus from Kevin Young)
Theocracy (Power metal - minimal stage presentation, but very very strong Biblical lyrics - even rivaling Petra in my opinion)
Project Damage Control (Sucking up to Brent, I know :lol: )

And... that's about all I've got. Anybody else have thoughts on this? I've heard good things about Red, but haven't heard enough of them to comment. Are there any others? Is there anything good in the Swedish Christian metal space? :P
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Re: Are there any "good" Christian Rock Bands anymore?

Post by gman » Wed Jun 05, 2013 5:48 pm

I really like Kutless, but they may be too tame for your tastes. I've have seen Skillet live, but not in a secular context. In a Christian setting such as a festival, they are very open about their faith, but not preachy. They let you know they are Jesus Freaks, but then they keep on playing. It's my impression that in a secular environment, they don't even go there.
How about The Letter Black? Kind of like Skillet with more of a metal flare. The girl has a great voice.
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Re: Are there any "good" Christian Rock Bands anymore?

Post by brent » Wed Jun 05, 2013 9:01 pm

When CCM was new, there was no CCM, so Christians were hungry for alternatives. Bands could push the stylistic and lyrical envelopes, because there was no big machine industry. Billions of dollars and generations of simple faith consumers later, it has become a formulated business. Today CCM has lost it's evangelistic punch, because most artists sell out and become likable, sellable, profitable.

The modern artists and music are just as bland as the American interpretation of scripture. Art is a reflection of society. So, you should be asking, "Are there any solid Christians buying solid Christian rock?" There is your answer. There is no market for it. If a band like Petra was starting out today, they would be told to dial it back, turn down the cliche Christian corn and appeal to the wider audience, because you cannot alienate denominations, ministries, etc. To get into all of the Christian retailers, you have to be via media, "middle of the road". To get to the world, you have to be more like the world. I know of Christian girl bands (BIG ones at one time) who were told to remove wedding rings and dress younger to attract the young boys. SICK! May those people in charge rot and bless the girls for telling them to stick it. I think this is only natural in the progression of commercialized Christianity. When you sell something, the product, the music, MUST cater to the needs of the market from which the money comes. This is why I STILL maintain, ALL Christian music for sale is entertainment (in my head). That way it is easier for me to deal with it.

Now, there is some great music out there. I can't speak for the lyrics. I try not to listen. But there is some killer musicianship and production going on. What I hope is that as people tire of simple 7-11, predictable, crappy, Hillsong, cymbal bashing, arpeggiated noisy guitar playin, drone keyboard irritating music, maybe the SKILL that the bible SAYS to play with TO GOD will return to the church. God knows I can't wait. I HATE WITH ALL MY HEART this simple, whiney, drivel. Someone write something with power and authority requiring some chops, that makes people strive to be better than the equipment doing the jobs for them. Rant over.

Edit: I too am sure there is some. It just isn't on the forefront like Petra used to be. I don't hear seminary instructors and pastors praising others like the do Bob for their writing skills, including good solid doctrine.
Last edited by brent on Wed Jun 05, 2013 10:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Are there any "good" Christian Rock Bands anymore?

Post by zak89 » Wed Jun 05, 2013 9:41 pm

Well, no one accused you Brent of not speaking your mind. ;)

But I must say, I agree with you 100%. The commercializatiom of CCM is a travesty, and I don't even try to defend it anymore.

At the same time, I'm reluctant to accept that there are no solid Christian artists out there, even if they are forced to fly under the radar of CCM Inc. Indie artists are growing out of the woodwork, and at least some that I've seen are intentionally trying to push back against the watered down commodity CCM. I believe there will always be true Christians who will seek to honor the Lord through their gifts, even if it means that their musical endeavors might remain an obscure labor of love. And in the case of Theocracy, I know that's a band (or songwriter/singer) who's not afraid to use searing, convicting language that isn't at all calculated to slather the hearer with positive vibes:
What’s the price you’ve named?
Well is it money, power, acceptance, or fame?
And will you sell out for a temporary gain
Or dare to stand up undeterred and unashamed
And let the glory fall to whomever it may?

When all the world is asking you to sell your soul
And to deny the cross for silver and for gold
The kiss of Judas or the bended knee?
Vainglory or humility?
The ultimate goal

All the treasure in the world so blinding
30 pieces of silver shining
Tell me what’s the price you seek
To place the kiss of death upon His cheek?
Blood money and the serpent winding
30 pieces of silver shining
Treasure fades away
Sold out for the price of slave
Predictably, I don't see Theocracy latest album going RIAA gold anytime soon. But from what I can tell, they're okay with that. And I don't believe they're the only ones.
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Re: Are there any "good" Christian Rock Bands anymore?

Post by mikey32187 » Thu Jun 06, 2013 4:54 pm

brent wrote:When CCM was new, there was no CCM, so Christians were hungry for alternatives. Bands could push the stylistic and lyrical envelopes, because there was no big machine industry. Billions of dollars and generations of simple faith consumers later, it has become a formulated business. Today CCM has lost it's evangelistic punch, because most artists sell out and become likable, sellable, profitable.

The modern artists and music are just as bland as the American interpretation of scripture. Art is a reflection of society. So, you should be asking, "Are there any solid Christians buying solid Christian rock?" There is your answer. There is no market for it. If a band like Petra was starting out today, they would be told to dial it back, turn down the cliche Christian corn and appeal to the wider audience, because you cannot alienate denominations, ministries, etc. To get into all of the Christian retailers, you have to be via media, "middle of the road". To get to the world, you have to be more like the world. I know of Christian girl bands (BIG ones at one time) who were told to remove wedding rings and dress younger to attract the young boys. SICK! May those people in charge rot and bless the girls for telling them to stick it. I think this is only natural in the progression of commercialized Christianity. When you sell something, the product, the music, MUST cater to the needs of the market from which the money comes. This is why I STILL maintain, ALL Christian music for sale is entertainment (in my head). That way it is easier for me to deal with it.

Now, there is some great music out there. I can't speak for the lyrics. I try not to listen. But there is some killer musicianship and production going on. What I hope is that as people tire of simple 7-11, predictable, crappy, Hillsong, cymbal bashing, arpeggiated noisy guitar playin, drone keyboard irritating music, maybe the SKILL that the bible SAYS to play with TO GOD will return to the church. God knows I can't wait. I HATE WITH ALL MY HEART this simple, whiney, drivel. Someone write something with power and authority requiring some chops, that makes people strive to be better than the equipment doing the jobs for them. Rant over.

Edit: I too am sure there is some. It just isn't on the forefront like Petra used to be. I don't hear seminary instructors and pastors praising others like the do Bob for their writing skills, including good solid doctrine.

Brent

This is spot on and it is precisely why I dont listen to many modern artists even the modern worship songs are a dime a dozen nowadays without any solid doctrinal depth and honesty. I am only 26 so I was not around when CCM had its day but those that I know that are within my age group and younger. Want to know why I listen to the stuff from the 70s and 80s (early 90's as well) and this is it, your post is my whole answer.

Sad thing is I used to listen to Third Day alot and they have even gone the way of every CCM artist who wants a bigger audience and they dont even realize it (I dont think)
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Re: Are there any "good" Christian Rock Bands anymore?

Post by p-freak » Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:42 pm

Third Day was good up until and including Southern Tracks (1999). Then they sort of lost it a little bit. I gave up after Christmas Offerings.
zak89 wrote:Predictably, I don't see Theocracy latest album going RIAA gold anytime soon. But from what I can tell, they're okay with that. And I don't believe they're the only ones.
Quite a sensible prediction there. :wink:
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Re: Are there any "good" Christian Rock Bands anymore?

Post by executioner » Fri Jun 07, 2013 8:18 am

gman wrote:I really like Kutless, but they may be too tame for your tastes. I've have seen Skillet live, but not in a secular context. In a Christian setting such as a festival, they are very open about their faith, but not preachy. They let you know they are Jesus Freaks, but then they keep on playing. It's my impression that in a secular environment, they don't even go there.
How about The Letter Black? Kind of like Skillet with more of a metal flare. The girl has a great voice.

I went and listened to some of The Letter Black cuts and they sound really good, they sound a lot like Fireflight which for some reason doesn't get enough good press. I will give Skillet the benefit of doubt because I've seen their ministry up close and it is real; John Cooper has said(paraphrase) in the past that they are not there to beat Christianity into you, but to show real love and where you can find it. I've seen them several times in the past 6 years and every show I've been to they are done a couple of worship songs and also they let people know that if you need to talk after the show they have trained people available to talk about anything.
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Re: Are there any "good" Christian Rock Bands anymore?

Post by brent » Fri Jun 07, 2013 8:50 am

That song sounds like Gotthard.
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Re: Are there any "good" Christian Rock Bands anymore?

Post by Carolina Petra Fan » Fri Jun 07, 2013 10:22 am

"Good" Christian rock bands do seem harder to find these days.

To me CCM became less powerful when worship music became it's own genre. Then everybody jumped on the bandwagon. Then it started dominating the radio. Don't get me wrong. I like some of the worship stuff, but it's starting to sound all the same. I will say that I like some CCM, though- especially the more unique bands such as Rhett Walker Band.

I liked Skillet's Comatose album, but not the Awake album.
Kutless has become more tame over the years. Disciple has too, but not to the same degree. Pillar's about to come out with a new album, and the rumor is that it will be pretty good.
I saw Red in concert on the Winter Jam tour this year. I couldn't hear a word they were saying so I couldn't tell you about their lyrics. My 14yo cousin liked them.

You might can get some info on some bands at
jesusfreakhideout.com
indievisionmusic.com
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Re: Are there any "good" Christian Rock Bands anymore?

Post by Jonathan » Fri Jun 07, 2013 2:57 pm

Carolina Petra Fan wrote:jesusfreakhideout.com
indievisionmusic.com
Agree. JFH puts out samplers every so often, and I've found some great stuff.

Also Noisetrade.
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Re: Are there any "good" Christian Rock Bands anymore?

Post by Psalm37v4 » Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:34 pm

I hope nobody minds my saying this, but heck there isn't much good Christian CONTEMPORARY these days either. As Brent said, the message isn't as strong as it used to be. As a singer, I try to find the songs with a strong, clear, no-holds barred message. Nowadays, there are songs about love, replacing the Lord's name with "Love." My opinion is don't be afraid to say His name! Don't compromise!!! And address topics the church needs to hear. There are already thousands of songs about the poor broken soul who needs Jesus. How about the ones sitting outside the church who want to come in but can't because they don't fit in, aren't welcomed, or might draw attention away from the worship team? Christian rock does a better job of addressing the more sensitive topics, I only WISH CCM would do the same, whether as an indie or not.

Most churches tend to think of any kind of rock music as being from the devil, so even my singing a good old Petra song wouldn't be welcomed unless it was more "pop" sounding.

Todd Agnew has some good messages in his music (tho I don't know how hard of a rocker he is) and I'd love to sing some of his stuff like "My Jesus" or "Grace Like Rain". I can see the congregation fainting from having to listen to such a "horrible" sound (to them). LOL
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Re: Are there any "good" Christian Rock Bands anymore?

Post by zak89 » Fri Jun 07, 2013 11:52 pm

Great discussion so far folks, thank you much! Slightly off topic - but not really - I think it reflects well on the legacy of a band like Petra to have a core fanbase of discerning "hearers"; sure, we all have certain stylistic preferences, but I think many of us share the sense of disappointment at where "Big CCM" has gone. I hope that pockets of "resistance" like this will be able to keep the music of Petra and other CCM pioneers alive, and maybe one day inspire "the next Petra" - because with all respect to Mr Powell, it ain't Third Day. :P
Psalm37v4 wrote:I hope nobody minds my saying this, but heck there isn't much good Christian CONTEMPORARY these days either.
No worries, mate. You won't be finding much disagreement here. ;) I've long speculated that the "harder" Christian music scene stayed a bit more true to its roots than the more pop, "family friendly" style of artists. That could totally be my own stylistic bias, but it doesn't take much effort for me to suppose that artists appealing to a more broad, radio listening audience (I'm looking at you, Amy Grant) would succumb to the pressure to "water down" more quickly than edgier bands who didn't have quite as much to lose right away. Speculation, completely, I know.

I find the modern "praise & worship" scene nauseating. I won't say more on that, but it's ironic indeed that Petra helped blaze the trail for modern worship music - we've come a long way baby.

Personally my hope is that we'll see more and better artists showing up in the indie space, via Noisetrade and other sharing platforms. I've found JFH to be pretty much accepting of any and all CCM, despite their "edgy" name, but I do have their two samplers, and I mean to check those out soon.
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Re: Are there any "good" Christian Rock Bands anymore?

Post by mikey32187 » Sat Jun 08, 2013 5:36 pm

The issue is this I believe, Petra and Keith Green set a standard that not many people have been able to reach. I am critical and have always been critical of merchandizing in the church and ways that man has come up with to get peoples butts in the seats. It ultimately takes the attention off God and puts it on ourselves like we are doing the saving or something. However back to KG and Petra. I am sure there are some others but there is no doubt in my mind that those two were/are in it for pure ministerial reasons, In fact Keith Green, if I have my story right, would make his producers wince because some of the things he said and sung were unpopular. Some people dont like hymns and old "stuffy church music" like God is not able to touch them somehow through it. I got news for ya if God wants someone he can move and touch regardless to the point where man has no control over it.

And as far as this rock and roll is of the devil stuff, I have been in both sides of the argument and I will say that both sides have some valid points just as much as invalid points. The simple rule of thumb is, if it ministers and speaks to you than its good if it doesn't than you are wasting your time. I am not a slave to any genre. I like church hymns (more so the older I get) just as much as I like more modern sounding stuff.

To me 95% of CCM today is all fluff no substance.
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Re: Are there any "good" Christian Rock Bands anymore?

Post by Psalm37v4 » Sun Jun 09, 2013 11:10 am

Actually mikey, I think it's more like 99% of CCM.... ;)
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Re: Are there any "good" Christian Rock Bands anymore?

Post by Psalm37v4 » Tue Jun 11, 2013 3:32 pm

I agree with much of what Steve Camp wrote there.
He is another one who was (and is) not afraid to address the sensitive topics.
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