Trump Tape

A place for Petra fans to discuss other topics
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Mountain Man
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Re: Trump Tape

Post by Mountain Man » Fri Jan 20, 2017 2:27 pm

curt wrote:"...Trump's xenophobic and indeed racist statements about Latinos and Muslims."

Let me know your opinions. Not surprisingly I happen to think that the writer is on to something.
Fake news, dude. Trump is not xenophobic or racist.

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Re: Trump Tape

Post by curt » Fri Jan 20, 2017 3:20 pm

Hillary bashing again. And no one is any the wiser as to how so many christians so easily forgot his racist statements or accepted his idea that all Muslims should be banned from the USA, including those who are fleeing Assad's blood bath in Syria in which he is supported by Putin with whom Trump wants to be friendly and cooperate. If those lives mattered we would not only hear the talks about unborn babies. Those who are born are of equal worth. Being pro life could find other expressions than a vote for Trump.

It's interesting to note that what some Christians are doing is being regarded as immoral or at least as a sign of bad judgment and I think they are right.

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Re: Trump Tape

Post by curt » Fri Jan 20, 2017 3:25 pm

Mountain Man, you should know better: http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_56d47 ... 60bf777e83

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Re: Trump Tape

Post by brent » Fri Jan 20, 2017 3:53 pm

curt wrote:Hillary bashing again. And no one is any the wiser as to how so many christians so easily forgot his racist statements or accepted his idea that all Muslims should be banned from the USA, including those who are fleeing Assad's blood bath in Syria in which he is supported by Putin with whom Trump wants to be friendly and cooperate. If those lives mattered we would not only hear the talks about unborn babies. Those who are born are of equal worth. Being pro life could find other expressions than a vote for Trump.

It's interesting to note that what some Christians are doing is being regarded as immoral or at least as a sign of bad judgment and I think they are right.
Islam is not a race. He wasn't being racist. Anyone can be a Muslim. Red, yellow, black, white. I am for locking down the boarders too. That is not anti-Christian. Heck, GOD taught his people to built walls around their cities, make their houses with pointed roofs, how to defend and conquer. Protecting is not a sin. the fact it is called a racist activity is laughable. We do not HAVE to let ANYONE in. Only those who can prove assimilation should be allowed to stay. My cousin is a Muslim. If she and her family are involved in crazy activity, they need to go. Family splitting for protection is biblical. It's just the way it is.

\If you want to be a socialist liberal, go live where you are welcome. The pendulum has swung. For about the next 10 years, we are going to clean house hopefully.

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Re: Trump Tape

Post by Dan » Fri Jan 20, 2017 9:22 pm

curt wrote:Mountain Man, you should know better: http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_56d47 ... 60bf777e83

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Re: Trump Tape

Post by curt » Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:26 am

Brent, you are once again avoiding talking about Muslims as our fellow human beings. You correctly point to the fact that Islam is not a race (which I have never claimed - I have pointed to a qoute that could be read that way, however I'm sure that's not the writer's intetion. It's too cheap to hide behind that)

The fact that they are not a race does not mean that they are not human beings and should not be treated as such. So banning an entire group of people based on their religion is still very serious stuff. You should keep in mind that The Old Testament contains guidelines on how to treat slaves so the fact that there are instructions on how to build city wall is not something I would regard as serious guidelines for politics in 2017.

You ask political opponents to leave the country, go where they are wellcome, kiss your read end and so on. Do you believe in democracy? Cause a basic part of democracy is to understand other people's right to differ from your own view without regarding them as enemies to get rid off. I think some of your expressions raises serious doubt on these issues.

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Re: Trump Tape

Post by Dan » Sat Jan 21, 2017 2:15 am

Curt where did Brent say Muslims are not humans? When has anyone said that they are not a fellow human? Are you Muslim Curt? If so all are welcome here. I think there are even atheist Petheads...

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Re: Trump Tape

Post by curt » Sat Jan 21, 2017 2:15 am

Brent: "My cousin is a Muslim. If she and her family are involved in crazy activity, they need to go."

The sheer fact that you even mention the possibility of that regarding a member of your own family seemingly based only on the fact that she is Muslim shows me that this kind of thinking is quite unbalanced and unfair.

(This is of course not a reply to Dan's post above. He posted while I wrote this.)

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Re: Trump Tape

Post by brent » Sat Jan 21, 2017 8:42 am

Curt, you need to learn to read the words typed and discern the message. I am not unfair. I am being JUST. My justness lines up with Gods.

Being my family member is no reason to exclude them from reaping the penalties of law breaking. My cousin was born, raised and educated in the Bible belt of the USA. She was once a professing Christian. She knows the laws of God and the laws of the land. I can't make excuses or concessions for someone with the same knowledge and accountability I have. No matter how much I love someone, I cannot tolerate Islamic nut jobs murdering innocent people, whether they are related to me or not.

If my daughter killed someone with her car, because negligence/stupidity, I would expect her to pay the same price, through the same process, that everyone else must pay. It would break my heart. But, the facts are, EVERYONE must obey the law and pay the same penalties for breaking the law.

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Re: Trump Tape

Post by curt » Sat Jan 21, 2017 10:49 am

Brent, you need to learn to be consistent and not change your views as soon as they become inconvenient.

I have criticized Trump for wanting specific rules/politics to apply to Muslims only (the ban of ALL Muslims). You have defended Trump who holds this view and in that context you mentioned your own cousin and put her in a suspicious context based on the sheer fact that she is Muslim. When I pointed to this fact and criticized your view as being unfair you start to claim that I should be defending some sort of politics in which Muslims should not be punished like everyone else IF they commited a crime. That is pure nonsence. What I have claimed is you should not have specific suspicions on them because of the sheer fact that they are Muslims. That is something completely different. It should be quite easy to understand the difference.

Finally you work out the following conclusion: "But, the facts are, EVERYONE must obey the law and pay the same penalties for breaking the law." I would never oppose that conclusion. That's why I am against Trump for wanting to do the opposite of that. He wants to discriminate based on religion againts people who have not done any criminal acts. He wants to ban ALL Muslims from entering the US based on religion alone. If you want to support that, you will contradict your own conclusion above to some extent even if it "only" applies to people outside the US. You have held to views that are logically contradictory. So make up your mind and be consistent.

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Re: Trump Tape

Post by brent » Sat Jan 21, 2017 11:33 am

Used my phone the first time and need to clean some of this up.

One thing at a time. Mohammad contradicted himself and his writings changed drastically (throughout the Quran). There are some Muslims who hold to the first gen writings, and Muslims who hold to the radical writings in the second half of the Quran. But all of them are the work of an uneducated baboon.

Next, the original manuscripts of the bible do not exist, but the copies of the copies use the same language. "One day" means what it means. 1 day is 1 day. 1 means 1. It is the same language used in the context of marriage, one man and one wife become one. There is no metaphor. The OT has several passages with words stating God stretched the heavens ands time. The use of the word insinuates this stretching before a major event. God created this world. If he is God enough to do it, he is God enough to either make it grow to adulthood within a short amount of time, or to create it fully matured, in all cycles of life. God is God. He is not the author of confusion. The scriptures given about creation came later in the OT, to counter other secular teachings. If God had wanted to speak in code to first century, simple minded beings, he would have done so. He would not have used the same words used consistently throughout the century that were never used as years, or thousands of years.

I believe in the six day creation, because that is what the bible teaches and what people repeated then. Young earthers forget, the Bible says that God ordered the chaos. All of the elements, here from the beginning, we're in place. They just were not organized. Of course the elements of the earth are billions of years old. The universe is as old as God. All of the elements of the earth have been found in the universe. It only makes sense that the earth's elements would measure billions of years old. But, it doesn't mean the final product of earth is billions of years old.

BTW, any human that doesn't change his mind as he learns is a fool, because he is not learning. Nobody has the best of their answers when they are born. They have them when they are on their death bed. Some of my views will change more. That is evolution.
Last edited by brent on Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Trump Tape

Post by curt » Sat Jan 21, 2017 12:07 pm

Clear as mud.

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Re: Trump Tape

Post by curt » Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:40 pm

Was this intended for another thread, Brent? It is not a topic we have discussed here.

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Re: Trump Tape

Post by Dan » Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:33 pm

Obama leaving the White house:

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Re: Trump Tape

Post by Mountain Man » Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:13 pm

curt wrote:Mountain Man, you should know better: http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_56d47 ... 60bf777e83
First of all, Huffington Post is a biased, liberal rag.

Secondly, those examples are either not actually racist (criticizing a minority person does not automatically make you a racist); flat out wrong (he has openly condemned white supremacists on a number of occasions, and his daughter is Jewish, so it's extremely unlikely that he's anti-semitic); are presented without sufficient context or details to reach sound conclusions (just because he was sued for discrimination and settled out of court doesn't mean he was actually guilty of discrimination; a settlement means that both sides had to come to an agreement, and it's just as likely that the other side was eager to settle because they knew they didn't have a strong case); and so on. I don't have the time or inclination to point out all the other problems with that slimy hit-piece.

You need to find some better sources, dude, because it appears you're reading trash that's not even fit for a supermarket tabloid.

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