Theological advice from unlikely sources.

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Theological advice from unlikely sources.

Post by no one » Sat Feb 18, 2017 11:21 am

I see the Trump thread is locked. Just as well. I wanted to respond to the line about taking "theological advice from Bruce Springsteen..."

The apostle Paul had no problem quoting pagan philosophers in Acts 17:28.

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Re: Theological advice from unlikely sources.

Post by Mountain Man » Sat Feb 18, 2017 6:17 pm

no one wrote:
Sat Feb 18, 2017 11:21 am
The apostle Paul had no problem quoting pagan philosophers in Acts 17:28.
Paul quoted a pagan philosopher to demonstrate to the people of Athens that they already understood the truths of God and therefore had no excuse for worshiping idols. He wasn't taking theological advice from a pagan. Read the entire passage. First he explained the gospel message and then said, "Even one of your own philosophers agrees with me."
Last edited by Mountain Man on Sat Feb 18, 2017 9:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Theological advice from unlikely sources.

Post by Dan » Sat Feb 18, 2017 8:20 pm

no one wrote:
Sat Feb 18, 2017 11:21 am
I see the Trump thread is locked. Just as well. I wanted to respond to the line about taking "theological advice from Bruce Springsteen..."

The apostle Paul had no problem quoting pagan philosophers in Acts 17:28.
It was locked Matthew because it was seen as no longer constructive.

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Re: Theological advice from unlikely sources.

Post by curt » Sun Feb 19, 2017 3:18 am

The message in itself is far more important than whoever said it. Focusing on the last part is missing out on the important part.

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Re: Theological advice from unlikely sources.

Post by Mountain Man » Sun Feb 19, 2017 8:37 am

curt wrote:
Sun Feb 19, 2017 3:18 am
The message in itself is far more important than whoever said it. Focusing on the last part is missing out on the important part.
The point is, you're far better off quoting Jesus than Springsteen, especially when the latter's message is so dubious (I really have no idea what he's trying to say, or what passage of scripture it might relate to; perhaps something from Ecclesiastes?). If we are to follow Paul's example, you start with the gospel message first and then maybe quote a philosopher or popular entertainer to help put the message in context for your audience.

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Re: Theological advice from unlikely sources.

Post by curt » Sun Feb 19, 2017 9:01 am

Avoding the issue, the message, once again. I believe you are too intelligent to have no idea what he is trying to say (though you may of course disagree with him which is something different). The more you try to focus on the person, the context or whatever that does not concern the message, the more I feel that his message is strong and important.

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Re: Theological advice from unlikely sources.

Post by Mountain Man » Sun Feb 19, 2017 4:18 pm

curt wrote:
Sun Feb 19, 2017 9:01 am
Avoding the issue, the message, once again. I believe you are too intelligent to have no idea what he is trying to say (though you may of course disagree with him which is something different). The more you try to focus on the person, the context or whatever that does not concern the message, the more I feel that his message is strong and important.
I really don't know what Springsteen is trying to say in that lyric, and I don't recognize any legitimate strand of Biblical thought in it, so my instinct is to reject it outright without further consideration. Best i can tell the lyric seems to fixate on fear, but the Bible already has the answer to that: perfect love drives out fear (1 John 4:18).

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Re: Theological advice from unlikely sources.

Post by Dan » Mon Feb 20, 2017 11:24 am

Book of Springsteen (Danish Standard Version)

Bruce 5:12-13

12 I got God on my side and I'm just trying to survive. 13 What if what you do to survive Kills the things you love fear's a powerful thing, baby It can turn your heart black you can trust It'll take your God filled soul and fill it with devils and dust.

Amen?

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Re: Theological advice from unlikely sources.

Post by Mountain Man » Mon Feb 20, 2017 6:45 pm

Um... no.

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Re: Theological advice from unlikely sources.

Post by brent » Mon Feb 20, 2017 8:55 pm

I don't know about Bruce, aside from him being anti-american. Pretty sure he is lost. I don't like the majority of his music. It all sounds the same. He sounds like he is bound up and just needs to take some Pepto and a big dump.

Have you ever listened to Willie Nelson's solo in We Are The World? Lots of unbiblical truth and blasphemy. Jesus was not successfully tempted and did NOT turn the stone to bread. Then we have a Christian band that called themselves Bread of Stone. People need to read The Book....REALLY read The Book.

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Re: Theological advice from unlikely sources.

Post by Shell » Tue Feb 21, 2017 12:11 pm

brent wrote:
Mon Feb 20, 2017 8:55 pm
I don't know about Bruce, aside from him being anti-american. Pretty sure he is lost. I don't like the majority of his music. It all sounds the same. He sounds like he is bound up and just needs to take some Pepto and a big dump.

Have you ever listened to Willie Nelson's solo in We Are The World? Lots of unbiblical truth and blasphemy. Jesus was not successfully tempted and did NOT turn the stone to bread. Then we have a Christian band that called themselves Bread of Stone. People need to read The Book....REALLY read The Book.
Funny take on Bruce and his music. :lol: I like a few of Bruce's songs, but I certainly don't agree with his political views. He's far from being the only entertainment industry-type who is anti-American though.

It is the message, and the truth of the message, that matters in the end. The entertainment industry certainly isn't guided by Biblical principles, and I don't know that they've ever claimed to be. Of course that doesn't mean there aren't believers within the industry. As was pointed out, it is important that we read the Bible for ourselves and know what it says.

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Re: Theological advice from unlikely sources.

Post by curt » Tue Feb 21, 2017 1:55 pm

I think his music is about as boring as it gets. However the lyric I quoted came in to my mind almost constantly when following politics. Again you can focus on the circumstances, or you can focus on the message. I don't think his own religious views (or lack thereof) makes the message any weaker. Perhaps even the opposite. I am suprised to see how easily many Christians accept or even defend the so called Muslim ban, a permanent ban on Syrian refugees and so on. I think some very, very fundamental values have gone lost in all of this. And that's the theme in the few lines I quoted.

I think it is a stretch to call Bruce anti-American. After all he did play at president Obama's inaguation in 2008 and had a good relationship to president Obama. That is hardly combined with being anti-Amercian on a general level. It is obvious that he dislikes Trump but Bruce has blaimed Trump for being un-American. How would one find that to be a problem if one was anti-American? You can read more about it here: http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/musi ... /97236886/

He has said the following on the ban: 'America is a nation of immigrants, and we find this anti-democratic and fundamentally un-American.' http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... rican.html

Of course if you have a very narrow definition of "American" you may find that he is anti-American. However, it appears that even Trump does like his music. At least a Springsteen cover band (yes, a cover band) was ask to play at Trumps inaguration (again if Springsteen was completely anti-American that would be rather strange). In the end even the cover band declined and pointed to the fact that they would not play, since Springsteen disliked Trumps political ideas.

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Re: Theological advice from unlikely sources.

Post by Shell » Tue Feb 21, 2017 2:50 pm

I don't have to agree with someone's political views to enjoy their music or enjoy a movie or TV show. I don't think everyone is required to like Trump, and it is true the definition of "American" can be different for different people. I don't dispute that. And I don't have anything against immigrants. It's illegal immigration I have a problem with, and possible safety issues.

My question is, if the situation were reversed and Americans were wanting to immigrate to other counties with no conditions, would they be allowed to do so? I seriously doubt other countries wouldn't have a problem with being expected to blindly accept every immigrant.

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Re: Theological advice from unlikely sources.

Post by curt » Tue Feb 21, 2017 3:14 pm

There is a huge difference between talking all refugees and taking none. As for the Syrian refugees Trump wants to take none at all. You can speculate what would happen if the situation was reversed. But should you base your own actions on speculations on how you guess they would treat you, or should you just treat them in a respectful way no matter what? I think the answer to that is quite obvoius though practical politics is difficult.

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Re: Theological advice from unlikely sources.

Post by Dan » Tue Feb 21, 2017 5:37 pm

curt wrote:
Tue Feb 21, 2017 3:14 pm
There is a huge difference between talking all refugees and taking none. As for the Syrian refugees Trump wants to take none at all. You can speculate what would happen if the situation was reversed. But should you base your own actions on speculations on how you guess they would treat you, or should you just treat them in a respectful way no matter what? I think the answer to that is quite obvoius though practical politics is difficult.
How did you get that from Bruce Springsteen ? :lol:

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