Read the first review of the Farewell DVD

[greenchili]

Petra had four video tapes with music videos although one was kinda compilation. Not very many christian groups had the privledge to do so many. It'd be kinda cool too see them all make DVD. Although I'm not a real big fan of music videos (I prefer live stuff).

As for not being viable. Well maybe in the since of the "purpose" of their ministry. But for example if they were opening for more modern bands or something they would still be accomplishing their goal of getting the good news out. Then the main band would play the stuff that appeals to the younger generation.

What can I say I'm just throwing stuff out in the air. Anyways 33 years is saying alot. If you subtract a certain number of years under the assumption that their popularity was waning it's still a great number of years.

I'm beginning to think the music industry is in some type of wacky transition these days. Alot of music is so watered down to the point of being boring. A few years ago there was all this talk about how the CCM market was the fastest growing music market. What happened? You would think in a supposedly growing market like that, there'd be room.

Anyways I'm looking forward to the DVD and when I get the chance I'm gonna go thru all the Petra video junk I have and organize it a little better.

[Kirkman]

It's obviously unfair of me to start criticizing the editing of the DVD until I've actually seen it. All I know for sure is that I wasn't impressed with the editing in the preview clip which tended to obscure the band rather than showcase them. But I guess I'll just have to wait and see how the whole thing flows together.

As I described in my review, the editing style starts off pretty fast and furious, with angles swapping frequently, camera motion, and zooming effects. However the band is definitely highlighted, I don't think they are obscured at all. There are tons of close-ups, lots of nice footage of the players playing (Bob's hands at work on the guitar, Lawry working the keys, etc). There's a particularly cool moment at the end of one of the songs where the camera is zooming in and out extremely fast (I think it's in time) while Paul is hammering the drums. Very cool visual effect that actually enhances the energy of what is taking place.

Some folks won't like it. If you are one of those people who hated the Bourne Supremacy movie because of the editing style, you may not like the editing style of this DVD.

Think about it: If InPop had put a little money into this project ...

I know this subject has been beaten to death, but don't you think they invested a LOT already?

You make it sound as if Inpop didn't invest anything in the "Farewell" project when it's clear that they did. Perhaps the project isn't as comprehensive as we diehards would have liked, but we're still getting a heck of a lot.

--Josh

[executioner]

I agree wholeheartedly with Winterlens' previous post.

Where did all the new songs that they were loaded with go during this time period? Were they too busy? Where are the new songs?

Where did you get this impression that they were "loaded with songs?" 2004 was a year with a pretty solid amount of touring. The reports from the band at the time were that they were working on new material. But I never heard or read anything that said they were "loaded with songs." In fact, I doubt very much that was the case.

Petra and Inpop could not agree on a new album at the beginning of 2005. Then John and Bob decided to hang it up. When that happened, any songs they had written were tossed out the door, according to John.

--Josh

We went to a thing called ShoutFest in September '04 in Sherman, Tx and because difficulties with the generator blowing up us fans got to get a lot of talk time with the guys. They were out at the merch. booth before and after their set. While talking with Bob I saw a glow in his smile and also in his eyes. He did talk about that he personally had written a few songs and Greg had written 2 song that he was toying with for the next album; He also made it clear that Petra was NOT done and that he was in it for the long haul. He seemed like a 16 yr old boy that had just got his first car.
Something changed Bob from September '04 to the spring of '05; Maybe it was Inpop's decision to try for another greatest hits or maybe something else, I don't know but Bob was different from the JAH tour than he was on the Farewell tour. IMO the decision by Inpop really hurt Bob and Bob finally said just forget it, we're done!

[St_Augustines_Pears]

Petra fans can be sooooo picky. I should know...I'm one of 'em! I was the guy who started a whole thread asking if GOD FIXATION is a "forgotten album" because there were no songs from it on FAREWELL.

Look, we as fans should consider ourselves blessed. Why? Here's a few quick reasons (some of which have been mentioned before)...

1) Petra existing for 33 years when most bands (Christian or secular) barely have 5 years of popularity.

2) Petra getting signed to Inpop and releasing a few more albums, when they could have packed it in back then.

3) Petra's last studio album, JEKYLL & HYDE, being a heavy sonic send-off.

4) That Petra did a "farewell tour" at all...like Schlitt alluded to in an earlier interview, they could have just walked away in early '05 and did nothing. Instead, most of us got one (or more) last shot(s) to see live the greatest Christian rock band ever.

5) Inpop releasing both a live Petra CD and DVD...again, when they didn't HAVE to.

6) Don't forget...John Schlitt will still be releasing solo albums (his 3rd CD sometime this year). If we can't have Petra, we can still have "the voice of Petra" (my apologies to die-hard Volz fans ).

Stepping off my soapbox now. I dunno...maybe it's just me. I'm gonna go listen to "Hello Again" and think about my Dad.

[Mountain Man]

There's a particularly cool moment at the end of one of the songs where the camera is zooming in and out extremely fast (I think it's in time) while Paul is hammering the drums. Very cool visual effect that actually enhances the energy of what is taking place.

Gah! That sounds even worse than I had feared! That's the kind of thing we used to do in our video production class in college simply because we were too inexperienced to know better. :(

Some folks won't like it. If you are one of those people who hated the Bourne Supremacy movie because of the editing style, you may not like the editing style of this DVD.

I actaully enjoyed The Bourne Supremacy, but based on the Farewell teaser clip, I am under no illusions that the Farewell DVD will be edited any where near as expertly.

I sincerely hope I'm wrong, but I'm not very optimistic.

You make it sound as if Inpop didn't invest anything in the "Farewell" project...

When I say "a little money" I mean "a little money to do it right".

[Michael]

When I say "a little money" I mean "a little money to do it right".

And when you say "a little money to do it right," you mean "a little money to do it Mountain Man's way." hehe

I learned a long time ago that "good" and "bad" are, in many cases, VERY subjective. There are songs that I absolutely cannot stand, and yet they are entertaining to thousands or millions of people. Who am I to say they are "bad?" Isn't it "good" that people are entertained? I don't care for American Idol, but Cat loves it. "Bad" to me is "Essential" for her. So I set the VCR for her, every Tuesday and Wednesday and sometimes Thursday.

The Petra video... I believe it's "Destiny", the one my wife was part of the catering for... the one that has all the high-speed stock footage of car headlights streaking around? To me, that looks pretty hokey. Couldn't they think of anything RELEVANT to put in there? But clearly lots of people like it. Not my cup of tea, but it may be someone else's.

I guarantee that you, MM, will NOT like the editing on the DVD, at least not on the first several songs. As Josh said, it mellows out quite a bit as it goes along, making fewer cuts and showing less of the crowd. But that doesn't mean it wasn't "done right"; that just means it wasn't done YOUR way.

[Mountain Man]

When I say "a little money" I mean "a little money to do it right".

And when you say "a little money to do it right," you mean "a little money to do it Mountain Man's way." hehe

Yes, but isn't that the same thing?

I guarantee that you, MM, will NOT like the editing on the DVD...

I'm not as hard to please as I might seem, and I am more than prepared to be pleasantly surprised. Heck, if my prejudgment is out of line, I'll openly say so on these forums. I'll even title the thread "I was wrong about the DVD". Deal?

On a related note, MusiChristian.com shipped my DVD today. I should have it by Monday, so I'm pretty excited!

[greenchili]

Yeah entertainment always has, and always will be subjective for the most part. It's probably worse for people who are familar with the techniques involved. I myself dont care for fast cuts, and "unsteady cam". They are good when used right, but alot of people seem to think they are the in thing these days and I find it annoying.

If it is kept to a minimum it aint so bad. Interspersing concerts with behind the scenes stuff and fans also annoys me. The you got the older concerts that sometimes use those hokey video effects. Blech.

Anyways the original reason for me posting is I was gonna comment about music videos, and in particular... PETRA. On the Beyond Belief video album the thing that I always got a kick out of was it seemed that on every song the video seemed to have nothing to do with the video. I was always amused by that.

[Michael]

I'm not as hard to please as I might seem, and I am more than prepared to be pleasantly surprised. Heck, if my prejudgment is out of line, I'll openly say so on these forums. I'll even title the thread "I was wrong about the DVD". Deal?

I hope that is the case. And again, like Josh said, the editing gets less quirky toward the end of the show, so even if the first part gives you a pain, stay for act two!

Yeah entertainment always has, and always will be subjective for the most part. It's probably worse for people who are familar with the techniques involved. I myself dont care for fast cuts, and "unsteady cam". They are good when used right, but alot of people seem to think they are the in thing these days and I find it annoying.

Very true... and because I do have a little bit of exposure to video (I've worked as an editor, cameraperson, and director for church TV programs) I feel the pain of the person who sits there screaming at the TV "EVEN I COULD HAVE HELD THAT CAMERA STILLER THAN THAT!!! HOW MUCH ARE THEY PAYING THOSE YAHOOS, ANYWAY?????" Sometimes I have a tough time looking at the video screens at church without shouting "Lead him, lead him! Don't let him walk out of the frame! Watch your headroom! WATCH YOUR HEADROOM!!!!"

For my taste, some of the shots of John's head are just as TEEEEENSY bit TOO tight. I don't necessarily need to be able to count the pores on his cheeks. But again, that's just me. And I find it annoying that in a day and medium where they could have easily done things in REAL letterbox, so that people with high-end HDTVs could enjoy it more, they apparently produced the DVD in old-fashioned "stick in a black box on top and bottom to make it seem stylish" letterbox (look for the one flash effect during a song that fills the whole screen, including the black areas, and then during the interviews the CG titles overlap into the black). Sheesh.

But criticisms aside, it's a fun video to watch. You guys are going to LOVE the concert, whether you love the editing or not!

[Mountain Man]

Alright, I got my DVD today and was able to watch it, and despite my misgivings, I actually really enjoyed it! The editting, while a little "thick" at times, was actually quite well done and didn't detract from the performance as much as I had feared. In fact, I would say that you could take pretty much any song from the DVD and release it as a stand-alone live music video.

Of course, I do have some (minor) complaints:

1) At times the editing is too much. Too many crossfades and effects and moving cameras layered over each other. It sometimes became incomprehensible visual noise, and I had to "reboot" my eyeballs to pick up the details again.

2) On occasion the audio is noticably out of sync, and other times it's not even close, apparently because the editor used some footage from other songs (you can tell because the lighting would sometimes change drastically between shots).

3) The continuity is a bit haphazard throughout, presumably because the editor used different takes of the same song, which kind of kills the whole "live" flow. It feels like you're watching a staged music video (which it basically is) rather than a spontaneous live-to-tape concert.

4) Occasionally odd shot selection. For example, when Bob Hartman is introducing John Lawry, the video is inexplicably showing a wholly uninteresting shot of the audience (audience framed in the lower part of the picture with a huge black hole at the top), or when Greg Volz is introduced, we see him from behind for at least 5 seconds before we finally see a close up of his face.

5) This is by far my worst criticism: They butchered Bob Hartman's guitar solo! He plays the intro then it abrubtly cuts to the end. It looks and sounds aweful. Curiously enough, the complete solo is played during the credits, which begs the question: why couldn't they have used the unedited solo in the video and the butchered version for the credits?

O.K., so that's what I didn't like. What I did like:

Wide variety of shots giving good coverage of the concert. Editing to the music giving everything a nice, tight flow. Clean audio (right from the CD, including the odd decrease in volume leading into the rock medly). Good video quality with a nice "film" effect. Great lighting.

So the final verdict is: Could have been better, but it's still a great addition to any Petra fan's collection.

[superfly]

I agree with you Mountain Man pretty much on everything. I saw it last night and the editing is actually cool in places, but I definitely didn't feel like I was watching a concert as much as other concert vids I've seen, including Captured in Time & Space. As far as Bob's solo goes, it would have been better to cut it out all together because it is not cut smoothly at all and just seems like a "what the heck was that" kind of thing.

The band interviews were awesome! That for me was the best surprise because it wasn't rushed like everything else seemed to be. The "behind the scenes" footage was ok. I only wished they would've showed the band taking their bows after the concert...I mean that's the farewell. Why they didn't show that I have no idea except that it would've taken another minute of video and audio.

Was anyone else's DVD case backwards with the DVD on the left side and the spot for any inserts on the right? I'm assuming this was intentional. Overall I like the DVD, but not as much as CITAS where you really felt like you were watching a concert, not a video of concert footage. Does that make any sense? You know what I mean.

[executioner]

It doesn't feel real at all and I think that takes alot out of the DVD. The whole thing was staged.



PROS

1. Live concert
2. Video quality
3. Interviews

CONS

1. Short in length(the whole thing just seems rushed)
2. Sound quality(I've had to totally adjust my settings to get a halfway decent sound; I do have a high end system.
3. In some cases John's mouth isn't moving with the words.
4. The editing is very chopping in places.


P.S. How much more money would it had taken to get this thing right? I'm very happy to have a live DVD, but my gosh at this quality it is somewhat embrassing.

[calicowriter]

That's what I was afraid of. I was really looking forward to having some of my secular rock friends watch the DVD and see what I have been raving about, but just as I suspected, this product won't capture it. All it will prove is that Christian rock is second-rate to secular rock, and the best Petra (who is viewed by people in the mainstream as the Stones or Aerosmith of Christian music) could get was a cheesy and cheap DVD that was put together by people who couldn't get a job in the "real" world of videography.

All it will be is a cheap souvenir for me because I was there.

[superfly]

My opinion is that it isn't a money issue because the DVD doesn't have a cheap look to it at all...I think it's more of a style or maybe a compentency issue. Bob's solo comes to mind, not showing John or Bob for half of the time they were talking, close-ups of John that are just WAY too close (and they were quite regular), etc. But at least these things are debatable. As far as quality goes I'd have to say the concert part is very high quality, and the things that I would've changed (such as what I mentioned above) aren't necessarily money related. That's why I like the CITAS video so much...it feels like I'm at the concert when I'm watching it. I prefer to see the band interacting as opposed to being able to count the hairs on their face.

[Pethead1]

Watching it now. Is it just me or do they ever show anyone more than 5 seconds at a time.

Glad I got it glad I didnt pay more than 10 bucks. A five year old could have filmed better. At least were you could see only one thing at a time. Maybe I am just too old.