Why?

[zman7720000]

[Dan]

omg lol... can I use the word retarded.. this is so wrong..

Wait till Brent sees this.

[brent]

I mean this in the most Christian way possible: I will be sooooo glad when the modern worship leader genre is over. The stupid faux-hocks, lazy, sloppy appearance, with the ink, thumb rings and lack of skill/talent can all go away and not a minute too soon. I am not judging the dudes heart. I am just saying that, I am tired to the music and the style (lack there of).

That music and participation makes me want to puke. At first, I was going off on this while playing it for Michele. But now, I am sad. I am so sad that some idiot thinks this is worthy of corporate worship.

[zman7720000]

[brent]

These are funny, especially the last two:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-O_GTze ... re=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjHMZKNKbTk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RJBd8zE ... re=related

[Dan]

I was brought up in an tiny little church as a kid, and my family left this church to get involved with a church that practices this rubbish... as a kid it was very damaging, and as an adult I feel sad that my Mum and Dad got mixed up in this, they were baby Christians in a way.. we all got sucked in to it... has any one else had this mind control?

[executioner]

This is really a shame.

[brent]

All of this church bs is really making me rethink my positions on Christian rock music. I might be on my face begging for forgiveness for buying into a really bad lie.

[Dan]

I should be working right now, but I can stop researching this.

[zman7720000]

Daniel,

I'm truly sorry that you and your family had a bad experience in church. Are you saying that God doesn't heal or that he does not move in that today. I feel your experience is some what unique in that the vast majority of pentecostal / charismatic moves of God are legitimate. I do have concerns about the theology of Ray Comfort!

[brent]

This is an example of how things get twisted. Let Daniel's message say what it says. Sure, God can heal, but it is not normative. There are NO APOSTLES ON THE EARTH. Apostles were specifically called by Jesus Christ himself while he was here. We have no biblical evidence Apostles were developed or called by men or the Holy Spirit following Jesus Christ's assent to Heaven. I have a REAL problem with self nominated Apostles, Bishops, etc, especially when it happens outside of the local New Testament Church. I said all of that to say that the healing signs of the Apostles are gone, because they are gone. The Church is to pray for, and meet the needs of, the sick. Of course, we can make our requests known to God. We have all kinds of biblical instructions on prayer, the condition and position of those who have prayers answered, and evidence that God does not answer every request we send up, even under the best of circumstances. We have evidence that people are sick to suit God's will, and that people do not necessarily have to do anything, aside from being born, to become sick. If God heals, HE heals. If God does not, HE does not.

Unfortunately, the Charismatics teach that we can speak ourselves a new reality. This is heretical. They do teach and practice mind control. Some of what they preach sounds right, but it is off. Fortunately, the majority of the AOG have denounced the Word of Faith doctrine, calling it what it is...satanic. There are so many branches from the Pentecostal tree. Some do not believe in the Trinity, among other things, and like many Charismatics, add additional steps to accepting the Salvation of Christ, like waiting for evidence via tongues.

I would highly recommend "Christianity in Crisis", "Counterfeit Revival", etc.

Some would say that some of these issues are not enough to divide and stop fellowshipping. I must then ask something then. If a church is practicing something man made, that is not of God, and is not in the bible (being slain, drunk and laughing in the spirit, puking your demonic spirits out, healing lines, falling out, etc) then it IS enough for me to say..."You're practicing show biz and teaching heresy, so goodbye." But that is just me.

Fortunately, the Charismatics, AOGs and Pentecostals I know, are VERY close to one another, very conservative, and believe in the scriptural form of salvation. So, I am not writing the all of them off. I am saying that they are all not the same, and they all do not support Benny Hinn, Copeland, TBN, Eddie Long, etc, etc.

I have mixed for just about everyone of the majors on TV, and I can tell you first hand, that it IS A SHOW, and IT IS FORMATTED and STRUCTURED FOR A DESIRED RESULT and MONEY IS THE CORE!!!!! These guys are sheep in wolves clothing!!!!!!! I would rather french kiss Satan than work for those slimy SOBs again.

The Blasphemy Network is the biggest seller of heresy, selling lies to the poor and biblically illiterate. It is no surprise that Paul and Jan are divorced because of his activities. It is no surprise the network has to pay people off to shut up. It is no surprise that Paul and Jan's own granddaughter is suing TBN and it's directors for the illegal activities she uncovered as the principal accountant/head of finances. She is going after attorneys too. She can't take it either and she knows more than anyone at this point. I think her dad is PC Jr, and he had to resign to keep his name out of the mud.

Look people. Look at the heretics that nut job network has on there. Most of them have been investigated by the government, sued, etc for financial and moral failures. Look at what they harp on most. Most of them are no better than the Catholic church, selling salvation, healing, financial miracles, etc. God cannot be manipulated to do anything. God is not some banker with a no credit check policy. There is no bank account in heaven. READ your bibles and let the bibles say what the bible says IN CONTEXT of the audience WHEN AND WHERE IT WAS WRITTEN. STOP using replacement theology.

[Dan]

No guys I am not saying that God doesn't heal today, but I am saying we must be careful of ministries trying to take advantage of venerable people.

"Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world. "

1 John 4:1 ESV

[zman7720000]

No guys I am not saying that God doesn't heal today, but I am saying we must be careful of ministries trying to take advantage of venerable people.

"Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world. "

1 John 4:1 ESV

Very much agree.

[executioner]

No guys I am not saying that God doesn't heal today, but I am saying we must be careful of ministries trying to take advantage of venerable people.

"Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world. "

1 John 4:1 ESV

I think these are all around us. You got to remember all these ministries were formed by human and not by God, so perfect is out of the equation, but I feel probably most were formed for the right reasons and just have fallen away mostly because of greed and sexual favors.

[executioner]

I hate it when churches and ministries ask for donations and money. We attend a church were money or donations are never asked or brought up in any official capacity; they've placed locked boxes at the rear exits and thats where the offerings are individually placed before or after the services; no plate is ever passed, no prayer is ever said, plus we've never have had a sermon on tithing. Surprising this has worked and our church's budget is met every year with a surplus.

Around tax time getting the amount you gave to the church the previous year and writing it off as charity, does anyone think this is wrong or at the very least insensitive?