Final Update on CITAS and free CITAS downloads.

[brent]

Brent,

Thank you for the information and your efforts. Is it possible for you to contact Mr. Greene and find out where CITS is available? I have checked iTunes and it is not available there. I would enjoy listening to a better quality recording than I currently have on Record.

Thank you.
Jeff

He said that it was. He sat on the phone with the catalog and told me that anything that they own (1,000+ masters) has been digitized and delivered to the DSP's. He specifically mentioned i-Tunes as being the hardest to get product onto, but they were the fastest and biggest mover of product.

I would look at the other pay sites as well. He said that if it is not on there, it is an issue with the DSP, and not EMI. EMI has them out there for sale.

Sue, I don't think that you are in the wrong anywhere, but I would call the powers that be just to make sure. You have John's blessing right?

Mr. Greene said that it was the RIAA specifically that has been bringing lawsuits against the people, not EMI. However, EMI and all of the other majors do fund the RIAA. The RIAA is the label's interest group.

[sue d.]

The 'powers that be'.... I'm not even sure who that would be... Bob? John?

[Jonathan]

I'ma say StarSong...they be the power to release just about every Petra song 5 or 6 times over.

[crossways]

PetraFaninCT,

I still don't think the point of this is money running the world.

The point is a very scriptural one: A worker is worth his hire.

Pay whom deserves to be paid, in other words.

As Christians we should be diligent to pay those whose services or products we benefit from.

The Pastor and staff - through offering.
Service employees (like barbers, waiters, etc.) - through gratuities.
Government Employees - through taxes.
Others - ???

AND ministers of the Gospel like bands - through paying for their products.

If I understand the Bible, all things that I am blessed with (money, material possessions, relationships, knowledge, and the Gospel) these are all from God. They are not mine. I am charged with the stewardship
of them. Therefore if God has placed before me another person or ministry that has blessed me - I should give to them what is God's anyway. Right?

So as I see it, the matter isn't money running the world. The matter is am I being a good steward of God's money by paying for products that a brother has blessed me with.

[Jonathan]

You make a good point, and I am sure that none of us would dispute that, barring few exceptions. If i can unfairly generalize like I usually do, we're all willing to pay.

Not all of us can pay triple digits for a used VHS of CITAS if and when it pops up on eBay.

Where else is it? Someone said it was available online somewhere...curious as to where...Brent?

[crossways]

I don't want to be too contrary or argumentative, but to what end do we go after what we want.

I really want a new Honda Pilot fully loaded. I really could use that vehical and all that it offers. I can't afford it and I am not going to be able to find one that I can afford - so what do I do? Find a way to get one by any means nessessary?

No, obviously.

I know - you're thinking, "what a freak, I'm just talkin' about a stupid video."

But it is the whole mind set behind it. We want the video. They are much too expensive to buy on ebay, so now what - take it from wherever we can get it? I just don't think that's the right attitude.

Now if Petra or whoever owns the rights to that video says - no problem put on the web and enjoy! Then fine.

But - if they don't give permission then it's not right - whether someone gets caught and in trouble or not.

[Petra_Pete]

[quote="PetfanInCt
For the love of money is the root of all evil.
[/quote]

I know it is a bit off topic here, but this is a pet-peave of mine since this is probably the most often miss-quoted verse in the Bible. It is "the love of money is the root of all KINDS of evil."

[brent]

And...it is the LOVE of money. It isn't the money. It is deceitful, mind bending scheming and other non Christian actions to GET the money, and to be in love with GETTING more money. Not the money.

Money is good. Without it, you cannot work. You cannot feed your family. You cannot get anything done in the world. The bible says to praise the Lord in all that we do. Do all things to the glory of God. How do we do that? We do what we are commanded to do. We work, we provide for our family, we provide for others in need, we forgive debts, we owe no man, we win the lost, pay for ministry. How can you do this without cold hard cash? You cannot.

This is a verse mis applied to anyone that is wealthy, has worked hard, has God given gifts, etc. To use the verse as it has been used here is legalistic. I grew up in a different time, where anyone that was wealthy "had to be sinful". While I do not believe this, I am not a faith movement guy either.

God has laws. You get what you give, bigger and "badder" than you gave. This is universal. It applies to the world, saved and unsaved. God loved the world first. He loves all of his creation. Some laws apply to all people, and all can be blessed by God.

[executioner]

I did find out some more info about the differences in downloading it on your hard drive and just rebroadcasting it like some have done here. It is illegal to download it to your hard drive and to burn it to a DVD/CD, because you have NOT bought a copy. Now if the artist or label released it and aloud you to do that through their means then it is perfectly legal.

Now if someone that has actually purchased a copy of the material and wants to come on here and rebroadcast it that is LEGAL. As of right now the labels and artists are trying to get congress to change the laws because they feel like they are due something for this. The judges are saying that it is not illegal because the product has been bought and it is not being reproduced or no money is exchanging hands. The artists and labels are filing civil suits about this subject, but as of right now are not winning in the courts. As of last year Aerosmith had lost a suit against someone that had an unoffical Aerosmith site and was rebroadcasting Videos and songs by Aerosmith. Not only did Aerosmith loose the suit but had to pay damages and the guy's court costs which ran into the millions. So you could see why Petra may not be willing to pursue a matter like this because it could hurt them more then it is now.

[Jonathan]

I e-mailed my bill collectors those sermons.

[Michael]

Matthew RJ,

I just have to respectfully say that what you have said is flawed. Money IS good. God created, and in the end is the owner of, all wealth in this universe. Money buys food for my 4-year-old so he does not starve. If I had no money, I would have to find someone who DID have money to help me feed him. Money takes the Gospel around the world. It recorded each of the Petra CDs we love, and it paid for the advertising that made us aware of their existence. Money shipped those CDs from the manufacturing plants to wherever we got them from. Money turns on our lights so we can see, our heat so we don't freeze in February, and our air conditioning so we don't fry in July. We live in a world that is made of materials, of matter, and money is the basis for the system of exchange which makes the world more comfortable to exist in.

I just took out a buck and put it on my desk. So far it has not bitten, maimed, or otherwise harmed me or anyone else. It's like it's just... SITTING there! Money is not bad. Money harms no one. It's your ATTITUDE about money that gets you in trouble. This dollar will sit on my desk all day long and not hurt anybody, unless someone comes in here and wants that dollar enough to hurt me to get it (and I want it enough to fight them for it). Jesus had money... he had a treasurer, and he had a suit of clothes that was expensive enough to be gambled over. He never told anyone that money was evil.

[brent]

Amen.

In addition. If money was evil in Jesus' day, why did he require it? Why did he have someone designated to collect and manage it (Judas)? Why does God say not to muzzle the ox (don't starve the ones that feed you spiritually)?

Don't confuse riches with money. Don't confuse being a good testimony and paying your way through life, leaving an inheritance for your children's children (biblical admonishment) as frivilous lust/greed.

The point of Jesus saying what he said about the camal going through the "eye of the needle" (which is a very narrow passage that must be navigated carefully, because of the robbers hiding up above) is that they will likely give up their life holding onto worldly things which they cannot keep if they die, and no riches save them. It is not that a rich man cannot be saved, because you can't stuff a camal through a literal needle. When it comes to salvation, "all things are possible" and "Jesus died for all".

If it were not for rstinkin, filthy, dirt money people, you would not live in the US, you would not have a bible, you would not have buildings to live, worship and work in, no (flawed) operating system (Windows) for your computers, no Christian musicians, no Christian music, nothing.

God uses what the devil intends to be bad, for his good. That's what makes Him God, and able to confound the "wise" with the silly. God's people want Christian rock and roll? Fine. The devil invents the music, builds the industry, WHAMMO we get what we want and didn't pave the way or pay the billions to make it happen.

[brent]

RE: CITAS. I do not look for it, and Richard Creene didn't tell me specifics (possibly because he is the man at the top that rolls the little pebble ideas down the hill, where the grunts turn them into big snow balls.

All I know is that is available. You guys have to look and demand it.

[Jonathan]

OK, do I demand it to be streamed or downloadable or to be bought?

[brent]

Demand that they sell it. They have had it submitted to them. They need to put it out.