Voice and Interpretation

[Enosh]

I agree and disagree with you Brent.

I agree he is indie. But he doesn't have to shell out thousands of dollars to make a CD. People are out there everyday recording at home and making CD's independent of a label. And everyone who complains about labels does not do so because they can't get signed. John has enough of a fan base that if he recorded a rock cd, doesn't have to be "industry standard" he could do it very inexpensive and sell a product to his fans on his website.

He isn't going to "make it" again. He doesn't need to. In fact he needs to stop trying to do that because realistically it isn't going to happen. He doesn't have to have "product" in stores. There are thousands of Petra fans who would buy it because he made it. Period. You think having John's last solo album in stores helped it sell? Nope. Everyone who bought it did so because they "knew" it was coming out because they were die hard fans.

Heck he could even make enough as he goes if you're worried about sales. He could do it, people do it everyday. I have sold hundreds of several different CDs and nobody knows who I am. People make decent money at it. John absolutely could.

[brent]

Those thousands of fans aren't coming to his shows or buying what he is making now. John should be selling 40k or more units. It's a false assumption that Petra fans will buy his solo records. He never has sold as many on his own as Petra did. A solo artist is a harder sell than the band the singer is in...almost always. Very few albums in history prove otherwise.

John has pretty high production standards and wants to use great players. In Nashville, there are lots of players, but they like to eat. Everyone wants something for nothing there. So, it isn't easy to find people willing to give up a month of their time and resources to record for free.

You are right in that there are lots of people making CDs at home. The average CD made at home sounds like a CD made at home, unless they are electronic. You cannot beat the low noise floor, isolation and lack of phasing in large, proper acoustic spaces of a room designed for recording music.

John has a "studio" at his house, but it is for VOs only. Last thing he told me about it, it wasn't set up for tracking a full band.

Assuming John could get people to play for free. Engineering, mixing, mastering, pressing, art, placement, publicity, reviews, etc all cost the same, indie or signed. Pros are trying to make money. If people are doing it for free, they are not in demand. If they are not in demand, they are likely not any good.

Selling hundreds of CDs is great. Many people would like to say that. But you have to think about John's position and mindset. He was in the greatest Christian rock band of all time. He has high production standards. He knows what he is worth. He has to live. Nobody can live on sales of a couple thousand CDs. When you are trying to do music on a large scale, your expenses are much higher than if you are selling a few hundred. He also has to pay himself for his time writing, recording, etc.

Ok, so a garage band, with no financial obligations can get together and through together a CD and sell it for $10. They get all of the money. Fine. Nothing wrong with that. But for a real artist, he has to be making money while he is in preproduction and production. He cannot take a month off, not bring in any money and then make a record. Those expenses must be recouped.

Selling singles is not working. This is why Apple is moving back to pushing albums, art...the experience. Singles bring less revenue for everyone. To release one single, you have to pay all of the expenses associated with releasing a whole album. So why not release a whole album?

Now, don't get me going about download sales. Depending on who you are signed with, you can make as little as .40 cents per download by the time it is all said and done. You have to sell a BUNCH of downloads to make it worth your while. Selling those costs a bunch, because you need marketing, advertising, publicity....

[Enosh]

Selling hundreds of CDs is great. Many people would like to say that. But you have to think about John's position and mindset. He was in the greatest Christian rock band of all time. He has high production standards. He knows what he is worth. He has to live. Nobody can live on sales of a couple thousand CDs. When you are trying to do music on a large scale, your expenses are much higher than if you are selling a few hundred. He also has to pay himself for his time writing, recording, etc.

Hey Brent I have thought about John's mindset on this and I get all that, but I would correct one thing. He knows what he "Was" worth. There just isn't demand for him no matter how much I or anybody else respects him and what he has done for music. I think if that's really how he feels, he has to change his mindset. He's just not a rock star anymore. To me sure he is, to the masses, no.

I know recording in a great studio sounds better, I get it. I get that he has high production standards. Here is where I'm get a little "Real World" You say you can't live off a few thousand Cd sales. I say you can't live off of "No" CD sales, cause that's what he's gonna get if he really is just waiting around for someone to foot the bill and for him to make a comeback.

If what you say is true about John's opinions, then I feel that he's gonna have to make a decision given he's pushing 60. Lower your standards just a little to make some income, no it won't be big time money like we all wish but it will put some food on the table. Or simply don't do music anymore. If it's still in his heart to make music then well make it on a budget like many other artists have. You can't always have those production standards and awesome Nashville studio musicians. Sure we all would love to make music that way, but as some other aging rockers once sang, "You can't always get what you want, but if you try real hard, you get what you need."

[brent]

For what it's worth Enosh, the last PDC album was produced almost completely in my home studio for a mucho less than $40k. It was more like $10k. But, I didn't get paid for my time, Alan was not paid for his, and I own the studio and access when I need it. (The MP3s are more or less rough mixes. The CD will have the mixed and mastered tracks. We wanted to give people a reason to buy CDs.)

[fcollazo]

Hey, just look at Greg X. Volz, he has released on his own about 8 CDs already. Ig Greg can do it, John can do it! Superchick's first groundbreaking CD was home made!

[separateunion]

I've gotta agree with Enosh. The demand for John just isn't there anymore.

[Enosh]

I know it must be hard for john to go from what petra was to how things are now. I just don't see that it has to be all or nothing.

Many former hit musicians have to scale back as careers change. It doesn't mean he has to stop doing music. He just has to change his focus. More intimate smaller venues. I know he's used to the best but maybe he has to change for those that do follow him. He could make good music cheap and make a profit. Would it be different? Yeah. But that's neccessarily a bad thing. People in Nashville have lost touch with the real world and what being a musician is about for petes sake.

[gman]

"Many former hit musicians have to scale back as careers change."

Lots of secular musicians have done so and continued to have a career. I think one difference though, is that the secular realm is much larger. They had a much alrger fan base to start with. As fans peeled away over the years, there was still enough left to continue their career on a smaller scale. The christian market is much smaller, so it can be more difficult to scale back and still have a career, because some of the fan base peels away over the years and there isn't much left in comparison to that of a secular artist.

[CatNamedManny]

I think one difference though, is that the secular realm is much larger. They had a much alrger fan base to start with. As fans peeled away over the years, there was still enough left to continue their career on a smaller scale. The christian market is much smaller, so it can be more difficult to scale back and still have a career, because some of the fan base peels away over the years and there isn't much left in comparison to that of a secular artist.

Plus the Christian market really doesn't seem to show much in the way of respect toward its seminal acts. There's no widespread respect for Petra, Rez, Sweet Comfort Band, 2nd Chapter of Acts in Christian music like there is for the Rolling Stones, Aerosmith, Led Zepplin, etc. I presume that's because Christian music seems predicated almost entirely on aping whatever is popular in secular music, so those bands no longer fitting whatever is current are immediately dismissed as irrelevant, regardless of the intrinsic quality of their music or songwriting.

[gman]

I think one difference though, is that the secular realm is much larger. They had a much alrger fan base to start with. As fans peeled away over the years, there was still enough left to continue their career on a smaller scale. The christian market is much smaller, so it can be more difficult to scale back and still have a career, because some of the fan base peels away over the years and there isn't much left in comparison to that of a secular artist.

Plus the Christian market really doesn't seem to show much in the way of respect toward its seminal acts. There's no widespread respect for Petra, Rez, Sweet Comfort Band, 2nd Chapter of Acts in Christian music like there is for the Rolling Stones, Aerosmith, Led Zepplin, etc. I presume that's because Christian music seems predicated almost entirely on aping whatever is popular in secular music, so those bands no longer fitting whatever is current are immediately dismissed as irrelevant, regardless of the intrinsic quality of their music or songwriting.

Chicken and Egg maybe. I think it's all about business. If there were enough of a fan base to demand the older stuff, on a smaller scale, someone would startup a smaller label to support the older acts and put them out there. Paying respect to the older acts is a nice idea, but one must look at the business side and decide if it is feasible. If it's not profitable and you still do it, then you are shifting the burden to the profitable side of yuor label to eat the difference. Or, if the older acts were all you had, you just go belly up.

[brent]

Captain Kirk can't live forever. If he does, he has to be REALLY, REALLY good.