Petra in Venezuela?

[sue d.]

an excellent example of the far-reaching effects that can happen at a concert:

Since I knew I would be walking and standing a lot that night, I used a rent wheelchair. This little boy saw me and came over to make sure I could see the stage. As the night went on the band decided to take a short break. During this time we noticed this boy and several others with him had jackets with "Knights for Christ" logo on the back. It turned out that his brother had been in a gang and in the past they attended one of Petra's concerts on a dare. While there the older one got under conviction and gave his heart to Jesus. He was so excited that he went home and shared the good news with his family. Over time, his entire household and other members of the gang became Christians.

Right there I had witnessed the power of Jesus through Christian Rock.

http://ps98-4.com/rocksolid.cfm

[separateunion]

an excellent example of the far-reaching effects that can happen at a concert:

Since I knew I would be walking and standing a lot that night, I used a rent wheelchair. This little boy saw me and came over to make sure I could see the stage. As the night went on the band decided to take a short break. During this time we noticed this boy and several others with him had jackets with "Knights for Christ" logo on the back. It turned out that his brother had been in a gang and in the past they attended one of Petra's concerts on a dare. While there the older one got under conviction and gave his heart to Jesus. He was so excited that he went home and shared the good news with his family. Over time, his entire household and other members of the gang became Christians.

Right there I had witnessed the power of Jesus through Christian Rock.

http://ps98-4.com/rocksolid.cfm

No one said this couldn't happen.

[knotodiswrld]

That is an awesome testimony, Sue. But it's also an example of the terrible responsibility we have.

The ministry of Petra (as well as other Christian Rock groups) has brought thousands if not millions to Christ. Some of those new Christians, as well as some who have been touched by those ministries but have not yet fully given their lives to Christ, will show up on this site.

If they see petty bickering; if they see debates filled with hostility; if they see that those who are called by the name of Christ are incapable of demonstrating His Love even to each other, then what do you think will happen to them spiritually?

The results are not difficult to predict. They will slink away, convinced that whatever they felt from Petra's music was pure emotion, that it can't be expected to last, and that nothing life-changing could possibly come of it.

Guys, we could be sending people straight to hell by poorly representing Our Lord Jesus Christ and our fellow servants. The testimony Sue shared with us should keep us on our toes and inspire us to follow the advice of our brother Paul:

Ephesians 4:29 Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen. 30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. 31 Get rid of all bitterness, rage and anger, brawling and slander, along with every form of malice. 32 Be kind and compassionate to one another, forgiving each other, just as in Christ God forgave you.

[knotodiswrld]

I will be straight up and say that if I had an extra $200 laying around I would gladly give it towards a Petra concert. Most donations that goes to charities(including ones ran by churches and Christian organizations) goes towards administration costs. Very little if any at all goes to helping someone in need.
At least I know what my money is going too.

This is simply not true in the example I gave of organizations building churches in Kenya and Tanzania. Since the work is primarily being done by locals, salaries are very low and there are almost no administration costs. They aren't advertising on television. I'm sure there are many examples of ministries like this all across the globe.

The bottom line is that the costs associated with putting on a rock concert makes it a very uneconomical method of "preaching" the gospel. Again, $4,000 to build a church and pay a pastor to minister for two years.........or hold a one night rock concert and sing gospel lyrics to a largely saved audience.

What you're saying makes sense, but it leaves out the concept of "untapped markets". With a Christian Rock concert, you can get people to attend who would never set foot on church property. You can, quite simply, reach a segment of the population that cannot be reached in any other way. That's true both here and abroad. There are many people who will go to see a Petra or even a Stryper out of pure curiosity or because they are friends with someone else who is going, but who would flee madly from the idea of going to church.

Many of those people will come to know Christ, and they will need churches. It may be in the best long-term interest of those churches to partner with Petra and other groups and be there to disciple the people who come to Christ at the concert. It is, after all, the Church's mission to reach the lost. If that costs some money, then so be it. Plus, those reached can become contributing members of the church, so the money can be recouped over time.

[brent]

With a Christian Rock concert, you can get people to attend who would never set foot on church property

As much as I would like to believe this, I have to say that this is not the norm.

1. It was the great commission to the church to go into all of the world and make disciples of all nations. You and I are commissioned to go out and bring people in. The church is not designed to attract unbelievers in and of itself. It will have unbelievers visiting for sure. But, we are to go out, get them, bring them in, and once they have believed, incorporate them into the body of Christ. If it takes a band to get someone in, then something is drastically wrong.
2. I cannot discount the work of a Christian musician. But, at the end of the day, we, the body, are called to do what we are supposed to do for free. We do not get paid by Christ or anyone else for being his hands and feet. That is unless we are sent by the church or are set aside to lead the local church body.
3. If you make a commercial product, good or service, and require the sale of that product, good or service for that product, good or service to get to into the hands, ears, eyes, heart and soul of the buyer for them to experience the ministry element, then I am sorry, it is no longer ministry. It is commerce for the dollar's sake and ministry is secondary. If we start charging for admission for ministry, then we are no better than the money changers in the temple.
4. While lost people can and will most certainly accept Christ anywhere God sees fit, by any means he sees fit, concerts are no more effective than any other method now. The church has globally accepted contemporary music for the most part. We are two generations in of people not being raised in church. Church is very different than what it was 20 years ago. The average church that would attract young people now has the same genre of music Classic Petra plays incorporated into their services. So, the thinking that we need bands to do what the church cannot do is wrong. In fact, because the church is doing so much contemporary music, the need for it commercially has diminished significantly. It is no longer possible to promote a Christian concert in many markets because churches offer them for free.
5. If we could put a dollar per soul equation on the table, churches, missionaries and Christian medical/civil engineering services are much more effective on every level.
6. In most mission fields, the people will come to anything. The people will accept Christ multiple times, change denominations multiple times, etc. They will attend whatever meets their immediate needs. I know many missionaries and they all experience the same sheep swapping that we see in the states. The conversion numbers are way off, because many missionaries and denominations are counting the same people multiple times. The facts are that people remain shallow in their faith, for various reasons. So, to say that a Christian concert is a draw and God uses them....well, that is true to some extent. But in some cases, it is something to do. People will agree to anything when desperate and take anything that is free. Consider the people that followed Jesus to see a show and get a free meal and then split it the times were tough or he called for them to get serious. Something to ponder.

[Shell]

I'm all for missions and bringing people to Jesus by whatever means God uses...But when you get right down to it, it has to start at home. The churches doing missions or outreach have to be healthy to really do anyone else much good, and that's not the case too much of the time. And there are plenty of messed up people right in your own neighborhood who need to hear the Gospel.

[separateunion]

With a Christian Rock concert, you can get people to attend who would never set foot on church property

As much as I would like to believe this, I have to say that this is not the norm.

1. It was the great commission to the church to go into all of the world and make disciples of all nations. You and I are commissioned to go out and bring people in. The church is not designed to attract unbelievers in and of itself. It will have unbelievers visiting for sure. But, we are to go out, get them, bring them in, and once they have believed, incorporate them into the body of Christ. If it takes a band to get someone in, then something is drastically wrong.
2. I cannot discount the work of a Christian musician. But, at the end of the day, we, the body, are called to do what we are supposed to do for free. We do not get paid by Christ or anyone else for being his hands and feet. That is unless we are sent by the church or are set aside to lead the local church body.
3. If you make a commercial product, good or service, and require the sale of that product, good or service for that product, good or service to get to into the hands, ears, eyes, heart and soul of the buyer for them to experience the ministry element, then I am sorry, it is no longer ministry. It is commerce for the dollar's sake and ministry is secondary. If we start charging for admission for ministry, then we are no better than the money changers in the temple.
4. While lost people can and will most certainly accept Christ anywhere God sees fit, by any means he sees fit, concerts are no more effective than any other method now. The church has globally accepted contemporary music for the most part. We are two generations in of people not being raised in church. Church is very different than what it was 20 years ago. The average church that would attract young people now has the same genre of music Classic Petra plays incorporated into their services. So, the thinking that we need bands to do what the church cannot do is wrong. In fact, because the church is doing so much contemporary music, the need for it commercially has diminished significantly. It is no longer possible to promote a Christian concert in many markets because churches offer them for free.
5. If we could put a dollar per soul equation on the table, churches, missionaries and Christian medical/civil engineering services are much more effective on every level.
6. In most mission fields, the people will come to anything. The people will accept Christ multiple times, change denominations multiple times, etc. They will attend whatever meets their immediate needs. I know many missionaries and they all experience the same sheep swapping that we see in the states. The conversion numbers are way off, because many missionaries and denominations are counting the same people multiple times. The facts are that people remain shallow in their faith, for various reasons. So, to say that a Christian concert is a draw and God uses them....well, that is true to some extent. But in some cases, it is something to do. People will agree to anything when desperate and take anything that is free. Consider the people that followed Jesus to see a show and get a free meal and then split it the times were tough or he called for them to get serious. Something to ponder.

Amen, especially to point #1. Also, one of the biggest failures of the modern evangelical movement is that so many Christians think that evangelizing stops at a decision for Christ. There is a major lack of discipleship of new Christians in the church today, and that is why most every evangelical model fails.