"The Greater Cause" - John's New CD

[LivingRock]

Personally, I think it's great that these people are proud of their country. In my country (Canada) a lot of people tend to take the passive approach when speaking about our country. It's a shame, because I'm fiercely patriotic myself, as are many others, but I wish we had more songwriters that are passionate about this country. I appreciate Luc Gingras and Ryan Caldwell for that area, as they have written some beautiful songs about our country. But where I grew up listening to, for instance: "In America" by Whitecross, "Honor and Glory" (the entire album, really) by Ray Boltz, (used to love that guy's music) "Homeless Few" by Petra (which mentions "under the red, white and blue") and diverse and sundry renditions of "God Bless America" and "America the Beautiful."... well, all I can say is, God bless them for loving their country, and I wish there were more of them on this side.

[executioner]

John loves his country and wants to see it stay out of the Obama toilet. Nothing wrong with that. Obama is an evil dude and deserves the hell coming to him.

Come on, Brent. Stop selling this kind of rubbish. I love the world and want to see it stay out of the Republican's self-righteous we-are-American-and-we-rule-the-world-and-if-you-don't-listen-we'll-force-you-to-listen-attitude. Obama is not an evil dude, Bush was. He started two wars for no good reason. Obama didn't.

I don't mind John singing these kinds of songs, but I completely disagree with his point of view. I believe it is not biblical (and not because he doesn't quote the Bible or doesn't say God or Jesus) and it focuses on the wrong issues.

So you people who live in the USA need to get a grip and just respect our point of view.

Respecting the point of view is a two way street, so take your own advice.

[Jan]

You people that live outside of the USA need to get a grip. If you don't like a proud, concerned and exhorting Christian citizen's calling out of his fellow Bible believing citizens, then skip it. Better yet, show me one a Christian artist from your country with the balls to do the same. I don't think there are many Christian artists in other countries that CAN produce a song like that. John is not putting the USA above you or your country. John loves his country and wants to see it stay out of the Obama toilet. Nothing wrong with that. Obama is an evil dude and deserves the hell coming to him.

Amen, dude!

[p-freak]

Respecting the point of view is a two way street, so take your own advice.

I do respect Brent's point of view (and yours, of course). I'm only expressing my disagreement with Brent's point of view by paraphrasing his own words. I think Brent can take that (after all, he's doing that to me/us as well). I've interacted with Brent long enough on this forum to know that underneath his direct and seemingly offensive words is a passionate guy who just expresses himself a bit strong sometimes.

I somehow wonder why you so heartily agreed with Brent's words and then when I use almost the exact same words recognize them as un-respectful.

Even though I strongly disagree with the two of you, I still like you a lot! And I still like Obama a lot better than Bush (and Romney and Santorum for that matter).

[pmal]

Not being from the USA, you're not going to understand John's song or its perspective of this stuff being a USA issue and not a world issue. Just the same, I would not understand your culture as well and don't pretend to. From this American's point of view, I am tired of watching our religious and personal freedoms erode here in this country. People had to fight for those rights and a lot of people fought and died to preserve those rights and now they are going away. This isn't about the world. This is about not being allowed to pray in public any more. This is about not being allowed to choose your kids' education and what they have to "learn"(evolution vs. creation). This is about the courts in this country overturning long held traditions and freedoms that have existed for 50 years because one family in 100,000 doesn't like it. This is about a manger scene that has been in front of a church for 50 years being ordered to be taken down because it no longer falls in line with a city ordinance. This is about kids not being allowed to eat what they brought from their own homes because a state appointed supervisor says it's not healthy enough (true story) and then being charged for it. This is about being labeled stupid for not just bowing down to "science", where there no longer can be debate about scientific data, but where everything evolution/climate change/insert topic here is absolutely true, even thought it constantly changes and contradicts itself. This is about being able to take your son hunting or fishing. This is about the ability to arm and protect yourself lawfully. This is about being taxed and subjected to paying for items that you morally disagree with. The list goes on and on. I know I could never make you understand that since you come from a different culture but for someone who lives here, was raised here, and now sees how bad things have gotten and changed since I was old enough to notice, it sucks big time and its getting worse every day. It's pretty freaking sad. Sorry, but I think this has turned into a USA vs. the world conversation and that's not what these songs are about, at least not from my POV.

[Preacherman777]

Bush was. (evil) He started two wars for no good reason. Obama didn't.

This shows a fundamental misunderstanding of how America works. The President does not have the power to just go around starting wars for no good reason. Both wars were were approved by congress (contrary to popular belief) and both wars, at the time of their inception had broad support among both governing parties. One war started to confront the radical Islamic terrorism that caused 911 and the other happened because of broadly accepted intelligence that Saddam was harboring weapons of mass destruction, which we knew he had not only had in the past but also used in the past on his own people. Again, contrary to popular belief some evidence of WMD having been there was discovered, although by and large it did not appear to be there any longer. None the less, the action was taken on good faith, and based on intelligence that was accepted around the world and by both parties in America. This was not some rouge decision made by a warmongering President. Obama started his own little unapproved war Libya that many felt was unnecessary, but fortunately for him, it didn't last very long so the world doesn't pay much attention to it. However, Obama's true crimes are against our Constitution, which I know doesn't matter to foreigners, but it sure does matter to a whole lot of us. He has, in many ways acted more like a dictator than a President, bypassing congress when his ideas are not popular enough to get through in the Constitutional process. He is trying to fundamentally change America from what it was founded to be and so you'll have to excuse us if a whole lot of us don't appreciate that very much.

[Shell]

This has strayed off topic and gone from discussing the CD to how arrogant and horrible the U.S. is. So what if John has what can be considered patriotic lyrics in some of his songs? There is the option of simply choosing not to listen to it.

As for Obama, Europe can have him. Just my 2 cents.

[Dan]

It is tough for the US citizen to see the way that Pieter and others see the US. I have been on both ends... and both Pieter and Brent are correct.

Firstly when I moved here, I realized that it is nothing like it’s perceived by the media in other countries.
Secondly the US media hides much of what happens when the US tries to police the world by creating wars that kill innocent people to get resources that fuel our cars that we drive at a cheaper rate than any other country in the world.

Bush had balls yes, but at the same time he had his own agenda that when deep into what can only be called some sort of secret brotherhood involving the Bin Laden family.

I think the U.S is going to be a lot better off with a new president, Obama has done nothing. Ron Paul is what this country needs… but the media will never let him have the seat. At the end of the day the Media creates the President, based on what big business needs.

We are brain washed by the media... The flavor of brainwash depends on where you live.

… that could be a good song.

[brent]

John loves his country and wants to see it stay out of the Obama toilet. Nothing wrong with that. Obama is an evil dude and deserves the hell coming to him.

Come on, Brent. Stop selling this kind of rubbish. I love the world and want to see it stay out of the Republican's self-righteous we-are-American-and-we-rule-the-world-and-if-you-don't-listen-we'll-force-you-to-listen-attitude. Obama is not an evil dude, Bush was. He started two wars for no good reason. Obama didn't.

I don't mind John singing these kinds of songs, but I completely disagree with his point of view. I believe it is not biblical (and not because he doesn't quote the Bible or doesn't say God or Jesus) and it focuses on the wrong issues.

So you people who live in the USA need to get a grip and just respect our point of view.

Really, Obama IS evil. Are you listening to what he and our former KS governor are trying to do? Religious employers are being forced to fund contraceptives and (now they are talking) abortions, via their insurance carriers. They are playing games. Obama has lied about working with Catholic charities and the church. You think Bush was evil and Obama is not? Obama agreed with everything Bush did economically when he was a Senator, voting for all of it. Then he lied and said he had no idea how bad things were, and that he inherited a mess. He VOTED for it. He aided it.

Hey, I am neither a Repubilcan or Democrat. I have to go with who is closest to a godly man. I have to go with who values the human life. I have to go with who does not work against the universal Church. When it comes to my country, I have to go with who will uphold our Constitution, and our way of life. Sad to say, both parties suck right now, and it is time for a reboot. We will get it. We will be absorbed into the one-world government that everyone is working towards. Obama is a tool to get us there, just as both Bushes and Clinton were.

[rexreed]

Let's get this thread back on topic.

[brent]

Personally, I think it's great that these people are proud of their country. In my country (Canada) a lot of people tend to take the passive approach when speaking about our country. It's a shame, because I'm fiercely patriotic myself, as are many others, but I wish we had more songwriters that are passionate about this country. I appreciate Luc Gingras and Ryan Caldwell for that area, as they have written some beautiful songs about our country. But where I grew up listening to, for instance: "In America" by Whitecross, "Honor and Glory" (the entire album, really) by Ray Boltz, (used to love that guy's music) "Homeless Few" by Petra (which mentions "under the red, white and blue") and diverse and sundry renditions of "God Bless America" and "America the Beautiful."... well, all I can say is, God bless them for loving their country, and I wish there were more of them on this side.

I love Canada. Good fish in' and land "spread out, so far 'n wide". You guys have a cool national anthem for electric guitar solos.

[brent]

It is tough for the US citizen to see the way that Pieter and others see the US. I have been on both ends... and both Pieter and Brent are correct.

Firstly when I moved here, I realized that it is nothing like it’s perceived by the media in other countries.
Secondly the US media hides much of what happens when the US tries to police the world by creating wars that kill innocent people to get resources that fuel our cars that we drive at a cheaper rate than any other country in the world.

Bush had balls yes, but at the same time he had his own agenda that when deep into what can only be called some sort of secret brotherhood involving the Bin Laden family.

I think the U.S is going to be a lot better off with a new president, Obama has done nothing. Ron Paul is what this country needs… but the media will never let him have the seat. At the end of the day the Media creates the President, based on what big business needs.

We are brain washed by the media... The flavor of brainwash depends on where you live.

… that could be a good song.

I like to watch the BBC. Sometimes I get news that is BIG about things happening in the USA, and our press is silent. Well, that only makes sense, since it is all controlled by the government and the richest of the rich. I don't like Fox, because they can take a good thing in a bad direction. But there are times when they are more accurate facts wise. Sometimes I listen to NPR about what has their panties in a wad. Then I do some research to find out what is REALLY going on, and many times I learn something. NPR is kind of the smoke that leads me to the fire.

[LivingRock]

I love Canada. Good fish in' and land "spread out, so far 'n wide". You guys have a cool national anthem for electric guitar solos.

Well, thanks, Brent! We appreciate our neighbors on the other side of the border too! (And yes, I may be biased, but I think our national anthem is the best one in the world)

[sue d.]

Man, this topic has gone all over the place! And you know what - John is cool with that. He is GLAD his music is sparking conversation and debate - nothing wrong with that, as long as it's done is a 'decent' manner.

I'm gonna go way off topic but in view of the recent posts - maybe not.

Here's a good example of how a simple thing by a little kid in my town got blown WAY out of proportion:

http://www.sheboyganpress.com/article/2 ... valentines

Beware! Christian messages are harmful to your health!

[executioner]

Bush was. (evil) He started two wars for no good reason. Obama didn't.

This shows a fundamental misunderstanding of how America works. The President does not have the power to just go around starting wars for no good reason. Both wars were were approved by congress (contrary to popular belief) and both wars, at the time of their inception had broad support among both governing parties. One war started to confront the radical Islamic terrorism that caused 911 and the other happened because of broadly accepted intelligence that Saddam was harboring weapons of mass destruction, which we knew he had not only had in the past but also used in the past on his own people. Again, contrary to popular belief some evidence of WMD having been there was discovered, although by and large it did not appear to be there any longer. None the less, the action was taken on good faith, and based on intelligence that was accepted around the world and by both parties in America. This was not some rouge decision made by a warmongering President. Obama started his own little unapproved war Libya that many felt was unnecessary, but fortunately for him, it didn't last very long so the world doesn't pay much attention to it. However, Obama's true crimes are against our Constitution, which I know doesn't matter to foreigners, but it sure does matter to a whole lot of us. He has, in many ways acted more like a dictator than a President, bypassing congress when his ideas are not popular enough to get through in the Constitutional process. He is trying to fundamentally change America from what it was founded to be and so you'll have to excuse us if a whole lot of us don't appreciate that very much.

Agreed! I think most internationals(especially Europeans) do not understand how the U.S.A. is suppose to work and I feel why so many like Obama so much is because he is trying to reform the U.S.A. into a Socialistic State or conform to the ways of the European communities.