Fake Drums Wish

[pmal]

Daniel's pic of Louie should turn into a caption contest ...

[brent]

"Uh...hey, uh....that is NOT what I played! What is this crap in my headphones?
or
(singing in his head to the Flintstones theme) "Space drums. I hate space drums. They are making me a mockery. When I, get done playing, they are gonna hear a word from me."
or
"Brent lets me play what I want for PDC."
or
"What time do we eat? I want mexican. Man I love tacos. When I was in San Antonio we ate great tacos."
or
"Yeah, I will play it again....but I am going to peanut butter your car door handles when I get done."

[Dan]

Daniel's pic of Louie should turn into a caption contest ...

sounds good..

[Dan]

When Backstage pass came out in MX on beta cassette it was missing the studio footage?

[imc]

That picture doesn't prove anything, all the studio scenes could have been setup and scripted for the video (like the "live" performances), or it could have been as I suggested in the last post: Triggering or embellishing the electronic sounds. Whatever the answer is, those sounds ain't real!

[Dan]

That picture doesn't prove anything, all the studio scenes could have been setup and scripted for the video (like the "live" performances), or it could have been as I suggested in the last post: Triggering or embellishing the electronic sounds. Whatever the answer is, those sounds ain't real!

Well of course, they must have setup Louie's DW kit in studio just for a 5 second clip of Louie saying "I'm punching it hard man, your going to have to give me more." yes that makes complete sense.

[imc]

Makes perfect sense. TV is all about creating the right illusion. Fans want see Petra in the studio, so they'll expect to see every band member doing their part. If it was the case that Louie didn't play at all in the studio for UP, they would have to have staged this bit to show fans what they wanted to see - setting up a drum kit for a 5 second clip is nothing in the world of TV. Anyway, if it was staged it's no different to their fake live performances on the same video. I'm not saying he didn't play anything at all in the studio for UP, all I'm saying is that the drum sounds you hear on the album are not real, and that the clip on backstage pass doesn't prove otherwise.

[Dan]

Actually, that’s interesting I have the opposite experience…

[Boray]

There is a lot of reverb on the drums on Unseen Power. Does that make them fake? There is a lot of reverb and delays on everything on that album. Does that make John Schlitt's voice fake for example? And how about the keyboards. I bet there are no real keys in there, like pianos or pipe organs. I bet they even used midi! And that is really terrible! I wish they remade the whole album all over with a real church organ...... or not! : wink :

[brent]

Like I said, I don't think many people here could tell me what is fake and what is not, because people's perceptions are influenced by the lack of studio practices. This is not a slam. There aren't many albums nowadays with real drummers playing at the same time as the musicians. That is not to say that real drums were not used. Many, MANY productions include samples of real drums, played by real drummers. Steven Slate Drums, Ocean Way Drums and many, many other packages are merely files of real drummers, playing real drums, in real rooms. They play single hits, patterns, fills, stops, etc. The average person will not know the difference. The engineers who use this stuff know, because it is used so much. When effects are added and things are edited, people don't know, nor do they care.

The thing to remember is that Petra was the Christian Def Leppard and they did what Mutt Lang did and use keyboards to play samples of drums. There was not one real human played note on the top Def Lep records. They used a Fairlight. What did Petra use to create 95% of the BTS album? Fairlight. John Lawry told me that they used sequencers, likely Akais.

[Mountain Man]

As I understand it, Louie would play in the studio and then the Elefante Bros. would take each drum hit and replace it with a sample to give it more "punch". So you're hearing Louie's drum work, just not an actual recording of his drum work. I read an article years ago where Louie was really excited when they found samples based on the brand of drums he used so that the finished album would sound more like his real playing.

[Muleya]

Interesting thread. Mountain Man's explanation makes the most sense.

I played in a band for several years in the late 90s and early 2000s, and our drummer played real drums, but rather than mic'ing the drums, he used triggers...made it SOOOO much easier to get a good sound out front. So I guess some of you would say it was fake, because the sounds were digital recordings rather than his actual drums, but it was 100% his playing that came across...and me, playing guitar right next to him, I heard the real drums and cymbals (in fact, I think my ears are still ringing from those cymbals!!)

And really, many guitar tones are processed the same way. The guitarist lays down the track, but then it is "re-amped"...the signal is fed into a different amp (or digital model) to acheive the desired tone. That doesn't make it a fake guitar...the track was actually played by the guitarist, and to me that's what matters.

There are so many ways to process sounds...just sending a signal through a mic is a "processed" sound, every mic affects the resulting tone differently. And it's processed again when you listen to it...whatever you listen to it on affects the sound you hear, as well as the speakers or headhpones you use. So there is no way to hear an unprocessed tone, unless you go to a concert where they play acoustic instruments and don't use any amplification!

However, if the musician is not actually playing their part, well, that's crossing a line IMHO.

[TerryB]

The thing to remember is that Petra was the Christian Def Leppard....

This would certainly be so in regards to Petra's work with the Elefante bros during the late 80's to early 90's. UP seemed to the climax of the Elefantes trying to craft a Def Leppard/Mutt Lange soundalike. Pull out the black gospel track and the slow stuff and the album could be a Leppard clone.

TerryB