Louie and Beat The System

[Toby]

I read in a post that Louie didn't play the drums on Beat The System because all the drums came from Lawry's synthesizer.

Is that true?

rock on!
Toby

[Petrapraise]

I don't know for sure but there probably was some keyboard drum sounds, that was big in the 80's. Louie was the drummer on note for that CD and the one before that and after that. He probably played on the CD and defineatly on tour.

[BriGuyPEI]

This came up in another thread a little while ago. The bottom line was that neither Louie Weaver nor Mark Kelly played a note on BTS. Bob played guitars and everything else was keyboard/fairlight programming, most of which was completed before John Lawry was brought on board. Although I think it was said that John did put some personal touches in there.

[brent]

The above post is absolutely correct.

Here's a little secret that ain't so secret. Sometimes album covers/CD jackets are incorrect. Many times credit is given to people for compensation, to cover for someones inability, for retaliation, as an oversight, etc, etc.

I would do the same thing. Otherwise Petra would have been selling a record with Bob, Greg and a computer. People still like to feel romantic about bands, thinking that the players/singers do what is on the CD, when the fact that much of it is assembled and/or did not occur in the studio as it sounds on the disc.

People hear about this and get mad, and often come back with "Louie is a great drummer and played live, so he MUST have recorded." Louie played very little on Petra records, and did not play at all on the JDB records. JDB didn't like Louie's playing and couldn't get what he wanted from Louie. So he brought in his own players. It was faster and cheaper than blowing through $150.00 rolls of 2" analog tape. $150 was a bunch of money back then. They would also eat up studio time, producer time, engineering time, etc. It saved money for JDB to use someone else.

On the Elefonte records, Louie did overdubs. All of the those drums were programmed as well. It is painfully obvious to me and others who record/play live. This was the era with the worst sounding, most robotic, drums of all IMO. The first PW disc was awful too. Atleast BTS sounded as if someone had listened to how Louie played live, and tried to replicate it.

[callbeyond]

I remember reading an article after John joined Petra, and BTTS was recorded...I remember Louie saying that he was so happy with this album..cause it was a band album, everybody actually got to play as a band.

[executioner]

This came up in another thread a little while ago. The bottom line was that neither Louie Weaver nor Mark Kelly played a note on BTS. Bob played guitars and everything else was keyboard/fairlight programming, most of which was completed before John Lawry was brought on board. Although I think it was said that John did put some personal touches in there.

I know Lawry was in the recording process for BTS, like all though it was very little he did. Like you said he added some personal touches that was all. I saw Petra twice on the Not Of This World Tour and Lawry was with them both times. John Slick played only a handful of shows before he had to quit for medical reasons(wife), but also they had to convince Lawry to become a full fledged member.

[Mountain Man]

I remember reading an article after John joined Petra, and BTTS was recorded...I remember Louie saying that he was so happy with this album..cause it was a band album, everybody actually got to play as a band.

You might be thinking of "Captured in Time and Space". Louie has never been happy about the recording process, and he and Mark Kelly were both vocally displeased with "Beat the System" simply because their involvement on the actual album was minimal. I believe CITAS was the first Johnathan David Brown produced album to actually feature Louie on drums.

[executioner]

I remember reading an article after John joined Petra, and BTTS was recorded...I remember Louie saying that he was so happy with this album..cause it was a band album, everybody actually got to play as a band.

You might be thinking of "Captured in Time and Space". Louie has never been happy about the recording process, and he and Mark Kelly were both vocally displeased with "Beat the System" simply because their involvement on the actual album was minimal. I believe CITAS was the first Johnathan David Brown produced album to actually feature Louie on drums.

No their talking about BTTS there.

[Mountain Man]

Well then, there's something wrong with somebody's information here. How could Louie be simultaneously upset that he and Mark Kelly "didn't play a lick" on Beat the System and happy that it was a "band album"?

[brent]

Forget what people remember, or what may/may not have been printed. Lord knows that the press and interviewers get their stories incorrect from time to time.

Louie told me specifically that the Inpop record was the first one that was played live, like a band would record. He mentioned that on the promo DVD as well. He and his wife will tell you that he is a live drummer, meaning that he likes to play live in the studio, and not chase loops, overdub, etc. The only other record that he had played live on, was the live record. He is on record as stating that he was at his best on that record.

There are many aspects of production that take the romance out of things. Louie's sounds may have been all over some of the other records. But he was editied heavily, sampled, triggered, etc.

I do not know about BTTS. I can only look back and make some assumptions, just like the rest of you. That was the first Elefonte record. If you look at the release date of CITAS, touring schedule of CITAS, and release date of BTTS, and then listen to BTTS, you will have a hard time telling me that Louie played on that record, live anyway. That was a pretty programmed sounding record to me.

[executioner]

Well then, there's something wrong with somebody's information here. How could Louie be simultaneously upset that he and Mark Kelly "didn't play a lick" on Beat the System and happy that it was a "band album"?

We are not only talking about Beat The System(which Louie & Mark didn't playon), but we are talking about Back To The Street(BTTS) which Louie and Mark both were quoted in CCM that it was a full band effort and they were happy with the outcome.
There is no misinformation here just someone misreading the abbrevations.

[Mountain Man]

There is no misinformation here just someone misreading the abbrevations.

Oops.

But in my defense the title of this thread is "Louie and Beat the System", so how was I supposed to know that you were suddenly talking about Back to the Street and that "BTTS" wasn't simply a typo?

[Toby]

Thanks to all for your posts!!

[philtvnews]

I for one thought Beat the System sounded mostly like bubble gum music. Petra was a rock band at the time...and BTS was like programmed music. I'm not surprised that Louie didn't play on that album....but I am surprised that he actually played on very few Petra albums.

[Kirkman]

We are not only talking about Beat The System(which Louie & Mark didn't playon), but we are talking about Back To The Street(BTTS) which Louie and Mark both were quoted in CCM that it was a full band effort and they were happy with the outcome.
There is no misinformation here just someone misreading the abbrevations.

Could you please produce that CCM article? I can't find it on their website (and they have many old articles from the 1980s). I've found most folks' ability to accurately remember old articles is pretty poor, so I have a hard time believing this until I actually see it.

--Josh